I see the times closing in because of all the distractions. Our enemy must really be trying to get everyone off track!!! Heres this distraction of Judas being Jesus twin, then another fish fosils, then another who the anti christ is. Man why cant people just FOCUS on Salvation!!!!!!!! While everyone is trying to be Prophets and bible scholars the enemy is out to kill, steal, and destroy.
The Church had better WAKE up and see the ambush coming upon us!!!
This Church had better get back to the Bible and what Peter said on the day the church started>>>>Acts 2:38 Repent and be Baptised EVERYONE of you in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ!!! And quit looking at the distractions.
Everyone who knows anything about war knows that the enemy will set you up with distractions!! While you are looking in the wrong direction you get ambushed from the blind side!!!
Hey folks Salvation is where we need to be LOOKING!!!!
Preaching the gospel and not worring about stuppid side shows!!!!
For a man cannot enter into the Kingdom of Heaven UNLESS HE IS BORN Of water and Spirit!!!!! And Acts 2:38 fits that bill>>water=Baptism Remission of sins.
The gift of the Holy Ghost= Spirit Water and Spirit!!! A Promise!!!
There where the church needs to look!!!! Not at all the mess people are coming up with!!!
I was gonna say I am sorry for sounding off>>>> But I am NOT!!!
We gotta fight for our loved ones and friends!!! Get back to the Word.
Back to the day pentecost started>>>Because Jesus is the Same Yesterday, Today and Forever!!!!! If He started it that way on the day of Pentecost , then He wants it the same Today and forever!!!!
Bro Mark--servant of the Lord
The Revealed and Restored Word Ministries

That is very wise advice indeed!!! I find myself struggling with this a lot lately. These "distractions" seem to be coming so rapidly lately... I can hardly keep up! I'm torn between my "duties" in the world and a longing to do the Lords work... guiding people to Him.

Thank you for the reminder. You've helped rekindle the fire within me!!!
We need that get up and go attitude!!!!
GO TEAM CHRIST!!!

May the Lord give us an unquenchable desire to spread the Good News!!!
AMEN!!

Blessings to all!!
Love, Lisa

All the side stuff should just remind us of how close He really is to returning, which should remind us of how little time we have left to do what we need to do, which should help us get off our chairs and get going. Thanks for the reminder!

These "distractions" you speak of, Mark, can turn either way with Christians. For me, personally, it makes me stronger in my faith in Jesus and makes me want to be out there even more for Him.

These attacks on Christ are so obvious, it's not funny and serve only to turn on the devil, while waking up the sleeping giant contingent of Christians....myself included in that statement.

There is ALWAYS more that can be done.

Yes I certainly agree with what you are saying. There should be no greater focus than 1st and formost our relationship with our Lord and bringing others to Him.
Yet He is very clear in His word to watch, be ready, Learn, be prepared. With this comes the study of His Word. He put the prophecy stuff in His word as well so that we are not deceived in the Last Days. If we do not know His word cleary than I can see where deception could come in. He told there would be false teaching, false prophets, damnable heresies brought in. Wolves in sheeps clothing. This is a part of being informed in the word and being prepared I feel. Do not quote me on this but I have heard the Bible consists of 1/3 Prophecy. Why would HE place so much importance in His Word if we were to never focus on it. Do not get me wrong we can get side tracked and go off on some major tangents. I understand that there is a limit to where we need to take things. Yet I do feel that we need to be watching as well and familiar enough with His word to understand when these events are taking place. There needs to be a balance as with everything.

Your Friend In Christ,
Valerie

Messiahiscoming

Amen Valerie Good balance

Mark, I agree with everything you said except for the water baptism thing of Acts 2:38. Firstly, we are ALL born of water at birth. Right after the water breaks. And Jesus was telling Nicodemus clearly that a man must be born again/born of the Spirit as well. Nowhere does it say that a man must be born of water a second time by immersion in order to be saved. That is mean to be an act of obedience and a public proclamation of our faith. But it doesn't add onto our salvation which is given to us only by our accepting Jesus as Savior. The thief on the cross is the ultimate example. And their are many other 11th hour conversions who are unable to be water baptized by immersion.

We receive the Holy Spirit the moment we believe/repent/accept Jesus as our Lord and Savior. There are four different baptisms in the Book of Acts. Acts 2:38 was Peter preaching to the Jews. They were "pierced to the heart" over what they had done, repented, believed, then received the Holy Spirit after they were baptized. But that wasn't the same for the Samaritans in Chapter 8 who Philip was preaching to. It says that they believed, were water baptized, but still hadn't received the Holy Spirit until Peter and John came to Samaria and laid hands on them. There is also the baptism of the former disciples of John the Baptist in Acts 19. That was similar to the one in Acts 8.

But the pertinent one in our day (No more disciples of John the Baptist; No more Samaritans; A very rare event that an Orthodox Jew receives Jesus as Messiah in this Age of Grace) is the baptism of the Gentiles in Acts 10, where Peter is invited into the house of Cornelius, preached to them. And when they heard the Gospel, they believed and repented, accpeted Jesus as Lord and Savior, and they immmediately received the Holy Spirit. There was only water baptism involved when Peter saw all that was happening and asked his fellow disciples of Jesus ow they could deny these new believers a water baptism. The water had nothing to do with their salvation. That is, the Salvation of any Gentile then or now.

It is to be an act of obedience without a doubt. Early Christians didn't care much if they were fed to the lions. They were rejoicing in their salvation and made it a public proclamation. Unless someone is completely physically unable, they should be baptized out of obedience, just as we observe the Lord's Supper out of obedience. But that does not save us. If that were the case, I'd be getting saved everytime I took a bath/shower (which is on a regular basis, I might add).

The point was that unless you are Jewish, Acts 2:38 has nothing to do with you. For them, it would seem that water baptism was needed before they received the Holy Ghost.

In Christ Alone,
John

THE BLIND WILL LEAD THE BLIND>>>>>THERES A NATURAL BIRTH WATER AND SPIRIT AND A SPIRITUAL BIRTH WATER AND SPIRIT!!!!
EVERYTHING YOU HAVE SAID IS ALL MANS THEOLGY. PETER SAID ON THE DAY OF PENTECOST TWO THINGS>>1ST WAS THIS IS THAT THAT WAS SPOKEN BY THE PROPHET JOEL THAT THE LORD WOULD POUR OUT HIS SPIRIT ON ALL FLESH> NOT JUST THE JEWS AND ALL MEN SHOULD BE BAPTISED IN JESUS NAME GENTILES AND JEWS!!!!
THE BIBLE SAYS NO PRIVATE INTERPRETATION!! SO I DONT WANNA HEAR IT IF IT IS NOT IN THE WORD!!!!!!!

JESUS ALSO SAID BEFORE HE ASCENDED IN LUKE 24:47 GO TEACHING REPENTANCE AND REMISSION IN MY NAME BEGINNING IN JERUSALEM!!!!
tHE CHURCH BEGAN THAT DAY FOR ALL. IF NOT JESUS WOULD NOT HAVE SAID THAT!!!!!

JESUS says we are to also do, as HE has done. JESUS was baptised, and GOD was happy and pleased with HIS SON. Baptism is the expression of taking the first steps in following JESUS example. It is the WORD of GOD.

GOD remains the same yesterday, today and forever. It is man that tries to change the scriptures to fit what he believes.

Mr. Payne, I would first of all ask that you use the fruits of the Spirit in your replies, without the exclamation points. I believe the redemptive work which was done by Jesus' crucifixion and resurrection is the only thing that can save a man/woman, and that is if he/she accepts that free gift. You're going on about Joel. Joel said nothing about water baptism by immersion as being necessary to be saved. There are 12 different types of baptism mentioned in the Bible. We know what happened at Pentecost. Now then, do you have any scripture which states that the original 11 apostles and then Matthias were ever water baptized? They received the Holy Spirit as tongues of fire. Can you show me where they were water baptized?

Also, you missed the entire point. I'm not saying that people shouldn't be water baptized. It is an act of obedience. And as Christians, we are to be obedient. I can tell you by the tone of your response to me that you have been disobedient to the Word in that their was no gentle fruit in your reply. That is, the fruits of the Spirit. I also agree with the last post in that it is an EXPRESSION of taking the first steps in following Jesus. But there have been countless people throughout history who had 11th hour conversions, and Good knew their hearts, and they weren't able to be baptized because of their circumstances. Are you saying that God has condemned those people to hell even though they called on and believed/received/accepted Jesus as Savior, but were in some trench in WWII for example? Are they condemned to hell, Mark?

You say that there are both natural and spiritual births water and Spirit. What about an aborted baby? What about babies who die shortly after birth? Are they condemned to hell, Mark? Or do they fall under God's grace as not having yet reached an age of accountability? Because they would have only experienced the natural birth of water and spirit, and we know that we are all born into sin. So, do aborted or miscarried fetuses enter into hell, Mark?

Did the thief on the cross go to hell, Mark? Is that what Jesus was describing as Paradise to him. Was it some type of play on words that Jesus was trying to console the thief with, or did Jesus, who is incapable of lying, tell that man a fact in that God's Kingdom is synonymous with Paradise? Because that's what the thief asked of Jesus...to remember him when He (Jesus) entered into His Kingdom. And Jesus assured Him that He would be with Him in paradise as well.

Mark, if you believe that, then you have just made water baptism a "work". And we know that we are saved only by Grace and not by works (Ephesians 2:8 and 9). Romans 11:6 also. John 3:16. Romans 10:9 and 10. Let me quote those for you:

"that if you confess with your mouth the Lord Jesus and believe in you heart that God raised Him from the dead, you will be saved. For with the heart one believes unto righteousness, and with the mouth confession is made unto SALVATION."

Verse 11: "For the Scripture says (in Isaiah 28:16), 'Whoever BELIEVES on Him will NOT be put to shame.'"

Verse 13: "For 'whoever CALLS on the name of the Lord shall be SAVED (Joel 2:32).'"

Mark, didn't he apostle Paul write Romans? Is there one mention in Romans about water being necessary for our Salvation? No. It is about believing/repenting/receiving Christ as your personal Lord and Savior. And THAT ought to be enough to make ANY new believer WANT to be water baptized out of obedience and pure joy. I've only been on this site a few days, but someone already wrote to me about water baptism because she hasn't been obedient in that way although she's been saved for a couple of years. And I asked her to pray about it, but strongly encouraged her to do it out of obedience and joy in having Jesus Christ as her Savior. I believe that any able-bodied person who is not before a firing line before they truly repent and believe, OUGHT to be water baptized by immersion, but it's not a matter of NEED. JESUS is what we NEED. And I'll argue that point to the very end, Mark.

You completely disregarded my original post in the way that Peter realized that Salvation was for the Gentiles also. And when he preached to the house of Cornelius, they believed, the Holy Spirit fell upon them, and they started speaking in tongues. They had just gotten SAVED. And THEN Peter baptized them in water because they wanted to be baptized to publically declare WHO they now belonged to.

But if you're preaching water baptism as necessary to be saved (rather than baptism by the Holy Spirit), you'll need to back that up with Scripture.

In Christ Alone,
John

Amen sister!

My exclamations come because I will not>>I say will NOT let mans reasonings and theologys sway me away from Truth!!!! From what the scripture says!!! God is LOOKING for MEN and Women with back bone and Truth! Not a bunch of self man made interpretation!
If you just read Acts 2:38 you cant add or take away>and that is what Peter preached on the day of Pentecost!!!There is no need of Private annalisys or ideas or interpretation!!! Read it just like its wrote!!!! Yes there are many forms of baptism but in Acts 2:38 he spoke of water baptism!!!! Luke 24:47 Jesus said go teach and preach repentance and remission in MY NAME beginning at Jerusalem!
The exclamation points are exactly what they are Proven POINTS!!!
The problem now days is because of people like you who want things to fit into thier religion. The Word says you shall know them by thier fruits!!!
And I cant help it if I have a fire and bimstone religion, because I believe Jesus walked up hill>not down hill. I believe in a Holiness and not a do anything you wanna do religion.
Being a hearer and a doer. not deceiveing your self!
Where does it say in the bible they were baptised for a PUBLIC DISPLAY???
It dont, Thats just another man made idea!!! or thought.
Just stick to what the Bible says, We dont need mans opinions.
Acts 10:48 is a command scripture of water baptism!!!!!!!!

Right, and in Luke 24:47, Jesus didn't say "And make sure you water baptize them."

So did the apostles get water baptized themselves. You didn't answer ANY of my questions!

[quote=MARK PAYNE,Apr 8 2006, 01:55 AM]
I see the times closing in because of all the distractions. Our enemy must really be trying to get everyone off track!!! Heres this distraction of Judas being Jesus twin, then another fish fosils, then another who the anti christ is. Man why cant people just FOCUS on Salvation!!!!!!!! While everyone is trying to be Prophets and bible scholars the enemy is out to kill, steal, and destroy.
The Church had better WAKE up and see the ambush coming upon us!!!


HOW about you with your gift of the spirit of John the Baptist....FOCUS on your evangelising.......maybe that's where GOD wants you. FOR someothers,,GOD has them HERE for a reason.....

I'm not trying to be a prophet, I'm not trying to be a bible scholar.
SOME of us are where we are for a reason.....GOD told us to "WATCH" and "BE NOT DECEIVED" and HE gave us an entire bible that ACTUALLY is almost entirely PROPHETIC........there for a reason......

Hey >>>Waytruthlife>>>>Romans 6:3-5 Baptism scriptures!!!!!

#1) "Should" and "must" have two diffferent meanings.
#2) What baptism was it? It doesn't say water baptism. They had the Holy Spirit come upon them at Pentecost like tongues of fire, not as water.
#3) Romans 10:9 and 10...just as I have already quoted in my post above. Those were the necessities. To profess and to believe. Period. That's why water baptism is an act of obedience rather than a requirement for salvation.
#4) Take Romans 8:9 and then read Acts 10, in how the house of Cornelius already received that very same Holy Spirit just by hearing and believing (water baptism wasn' required becaue the Holy Spirit indwelt them because of their repentance and belief.

Again, you have not answered any of my questions. What about the thief on the cross? What about infants? What about 11th hour conversions? And if you think that Romans 6:3-5 means that the other 12 apostles were water baptized, you're just assuming that.

Mark...slow down...we'll listen to you. but think...the pain in your life is coming out in response to not being listened to. But you have to listen back. What we tell you won't hurt you. Our words heal not hurt. They're good not bad...edifying.

Could you be blocking something else out? just guessing....

I bet you have an interesting testimony.

Yes I do and maybe you are right about slowing down, but you just got to know that the zeal I have is a good one. When the Bible plainly says what it does in Acts 2:38 I just get tired of man trying to add or take away. I dont see why they cant just read it and obey it???
There is always someones opinion. And the Lord has revealed to me it is a IMPORTANT revelation that He is trying to get the church to see. I have done months of study on this subject and found when man and the Nicea council changed things in 325 a.d.>>>Just look in catholic encylopedia.Look in the Ephesan Church in revelation 2: They fallen away from thier first Love already.
So all I am doing is trying to stand on the Word and get back to the scripture with no private interpretation.Thats why Jesus is standing on the outside of the door knocking. Hes trying to come back in.Because man has put Him and His name out.
And have added all the doctrines and creeds and ideas that are not even written in the Word.
And since time is at hand He is looking for man and woman who will stand for the Word since we are in the time where the Word has been Restored.
Why would Peter have said and Everyone of you if he didnt mean it??
And why would only a few get baptised in Jesus name and not the rest of us?? That wouldnt make any sence!
Even in Acts 19:1-6 They we REBAPTISED.
And if you really wanna hear my testimony I would be glad to give it to you.
I was drawn supernaturally to the Water baptism in Jesus Name even before I knew anything about Church politics. And when I came up out of the Water all I could see was everyone there was dressed in White! And I shook like crazy and was speaking in a language I couldnt understand.
I couldnt wait to get dressed and see the people again, but when I did they were all back in thier normal clothes. But there was such a Love over me I just wanted to hold and hug everyone in sight. And at the time I was in a pentecosatal church where hugging the opposite sex was ruled a no-no. I didnt care, my love for all was so great I hugged everyone!!
So when someone argues what the bible says >Yes I do get a little fired up. Because its a True Baptism of Fire. So your right I will slow down and maybe just have the attitude if a person doesnt wanna be baptised in Jesus name and be buried with Him in baptism and raised with Him in His resurrection and not see what Peter was talking about then just leave it alone. [ Not] I will not let the devil get rid of me that easy!!! hahahahaha
Anyway I just want everyone to experiance what I did, and and maybe they just cant because they are too blinded by theology.
But I do Love you all>>>>>>>Back to the day of Pentecost.

Mark,

I'm very happy to hear your testimony. Anytime someone gets saved, we know that there is one more for God's Kingdom. But I'm going strictly by the Word of God, man. I'm no theologian wrapped up in early catholic man-made doctrine. There was a guy by the name of Tertullian who lived a few centuries A.D. if I remember correctly. People started listening to him, and catholics in particular, and before you knew it, they were immersing sick babies into water and were drowning babies or sick people. That is not God. God is not the author of confusion.

In Acts 2:38, whether it was at Pentecost or not, you have to understand the audience who Peter was talking to. There were only Jews present. He was talking directly to them. It was only in Acts 10 when God revealed to Peter in that dream/vision that Salvation was for the Gentiles too. Those were the first Gentiles who were saved. Do you understand that? That's not "theology". That's the Word of God. You're talking about "re-baptism" for the OT followers of John the Baptist. I say OT because Jesus had not yet been crucified and resurrected before they were following John the Baptist. Read the entire Chapter. Don't just take text out of context.

As for you saying to get baptized because Jesus got baptized, I don't think you understand fully what Levitical Law said. Levitical law was for God's Chosen People. And Jesus was fulfilling Scripture and being obedient to Levitical Law in that for any Jew from the line of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob who wanted to be a priest/teacher/rabbi was to be baptized at the age of 30. And as Jesus is called the Lion of Judah, He was obeying the Law. But Levitical Law of the OT was not even for Gentiles to begin with. That's why Jews still eat kosher and we as Christians don't worry about trivial things. So Jesus was baptized to fulfill Levitical Law of a teacher/rabbi. Are you a Jewish rabbi/teacher? Of course not. He wasn't doing it to be an "example" for us.

I want to make some things clear to you, Mark. I don't mince words. I'm saved by repenting and believing in Jesus Christ as my Lord and Savior. He is my Redeemer. When I got saved, I also got baptized afterwards out of obedience and because I wanted to. That is the point. Every believer ought to want to do it out of pure joy. And I do get uncomfortable when I talk to someone who claims that they're a believer but they have a thing where they're not sure about getting baptized. To me, any true believer should WANT to get baptized. When someone has hangups about it, it makes me wonder if they're truly saved. But if someone really does believe and is truly saved, if they got shot before they made it to the baptismal, they're still going to Heaven...just like the thief on the cross. Do you remember what happened at Columbine? I'm sure you've heard the true story of the girl who had the gun to her face and the kid who was pointing it at her asked her if she believed in Jesus, and when she said yes, she knew beforehand that he was going to kill her for professing her faith, but she didn't care. She was not ashamed. But I'll bet you that there were many other kids in that school that day who were hiding behind desks and in classrooms and running in the hallway who were praying to God. Maybe they had always used the Lord's name in vain before that day. I imagine that there may not have been on student there that day when it was happening where if they didn't say "Oh God!" and mean it, they were praying it, and I'm sure there were some of those same students who might not have been believers before, but when they realized they were going to die, they remembered what they had heard about Jesus at some point in their lives, and they prayed to Him to forgive them for their unbelief. I'll go a step further and say that I'll bet that there wasn't anyone there praying to any Hindu "gods" or "Buddha" or "Allah/Mohammad" on that day. It was an attack against Christians. But the point is that there are many people who don't turn to God until they're lying flat on their backs and the only place left to look is up to Him. And that means that there are 11th-hour conversions like the thief on the Cross. And when we call on Jesus, He hears our call.

The whole purpose of God the Father sending God the Son to be a ransom for us, and the whole reason for Jesus accepting the commission was NOT to make it complicated for someone to get saved. It was complicated before that. No one could keep even a small number of the 613 Levitical laws. God wants everyone saved who wants to be saved. It's there for anyone and everyone. And God would not keep anyone out of Heaven who really believed in Him but didn't get the chance to be water baptized. If you believe that, you continue to make it a work. And the only thing that we can be baptized in and washed with to save us is this: "Nothing but the Blood of Jesus."

In Christ Alone,
John

I enjoyed your testimony as well. I don't have time now but l want to tell you about my own unusual baptism experiance. I will say however, l don't see it as a rock hard law but l do see a supernatural experiance in it for people who truly believe. I don't think they always know it..but it's there.