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everwatchful
Ok, I know, I know...

"The antichrist signs a treaty, and establishes a coventant with all for seven years! That's the seventieth week of Daniel!!!"

I understand, but please, be openminded, and try not to freak out. What I propose is a seven year period before the antichrist, in which the seals are opened, and the trumpets are blown. I've read nowhere that says that the white horseman is the antichrist, and if you have, please, tell me where so I can correct myself. I also understand that some of my terminology may confuse some people, and if this is the case, ask me to clarify before you chain me to the telephone pole and stone me to death. I've posted this on other forums and was met with reactions ranging from passive aggressive sniping, to understanding, and from all out mockery (which I never take too well, although I'll try to be graceful if encountered with it here.) to being called names. I like questions, but if you want to be a meanie about it, please try and remember, I'm not trying to confuse, or write my own doctrine. I'm a Bible Christian, and I believe that as my brothers and sisters, you can all act Christian about any questions or problems you have with my timeline. I haven't done any overlapping, and there's no gap insterted anywhere, it's non-Preterist, and non-Dispenionalist. The spans of time are based on seal number seven (silence for a half and hour), and trumpet number five (they hurt men for five months), and all seals and trumpets are broken down into six month segments because of this.

My motivation for this timeline stemmed from a question I posed to myself:
Given what we know wbout the Bible, and Biblical prophecy, what could possibly hapen that would deceive the very elect? As I pondered, I came to the conclusion that if seven years passed, and all of these things that could be called seals and trumps happened, who would everyone on Earth expect next? This is the only way the antichrist could be accepted, as anyone who stands up during the seals and trumps would be instantly called antichrist (because it is commonly thought antichrist will come durring the seals and trumps), and if he died at the hands of someone, who would the world think HE was? If seven years of seals and trumpets passed, and a man stood up to unite the world, how many churches would proclaim him 'Christ'? I feel that this is the only possible way the elect could be deceived, due to the depth of the knowledge in Bible prophecy in the Christian community these days, and the lack of outside non-Biblical doctrine in most congregations. We as His flock, need to be wise as serpents, and this wisdom needs to be available to all, meaning one shouldn't have to know other languages to understand the Bible, nor the prophecy in it. Children should understand it, and assigning crazy, jump-around, overlapping timelines to the last days of the current age of man is counter-layterm. If Revelation were written as a riddle, it would hardly be a Revelation, now would it?

Now, without any further delay, I give you my timeline, based on a linear interpretation of Revelation, citing primarially Revelation. I know, there are other prophetic books in the Bible. But Revelation is the only one labeled 'The Revelation of Jesus Christ', and in the New Testament. I'm not degrading the value of the others, but I feel that the book of Revelation is a one stop shop for all we're going to encounter in those last days, and is inclusive of all prophecy in all other books regarding the last days. Once again, if I'm wrong, give me the scripture to support my incorrect view, and I'll accept it gracefully. Also, I understand a vast majority of the events start in Jerusalem (ie- Ezekiel 9), but as a Christian, I'm going from a worldview, as opposed to a Jerusalem centric point of view, since there are Christians everywhere on Earth.

Here it is:

Unofficial Theoretical Timeline
Rev 6:1,2
1st Seal - day 0 - 180: White Horseman goes out to conquer. King type, possibly the EU, or an EU affiliated nation. Of note are the bow and crown. The bow, being a ranged weapon, not meant for close contact warfare suggests missiles, or even a Bay of Pigs type of conquest, in which a developed country uses thier nuclear arsenal to intimidate other nations into submission. Another possibility is a Parthian Bow concept, which means a shot or blow which one cannot recover from. A possibility is the 30', 14 ton Tungsten rods floating around the earth designed as inertia weapons. These would, in essence, cause a multimile wide crater in the earth, along with a shock wave that could be felt around the world up to 3 times. The crown suggests a king, president, or other supreme dignitary which controls this action. You'll notice, the rider of this white horse doesn't have a crown, but is given a crown, possibly meaning he is appointed and then starts his conquest at the beginning of his reign. This man will obviously be mistaken for the antichrist, as that is oftentimes who he is labeled as. This is one of the first deceptions, having existed far prior to this horseman's ride, and started by God knows who. Common sense tells you otherwise, as the mathematic harmony of the Book of Revelation suggests it is a point for point, in order timeline of events to occur. The mathematic structure of Revelation can be discussed with a man named Vernon Jenkins, MSc, who has done extensive research on the mathematic structure of the Bible, finding that the first five (Torah), and the last (Revelation) books of the Bible display a statistically impossible harmony to imbed without one actually being inspired and guided by God Himself during the writing process. (That's right. Proof of the Bible.)
Rev 6:3,4
2nd Seal - day 181 - 360: Red Horseman goes to make war. Good chance this red horseman is the reunified USSR, along with it's new allies China, Iran, Sudan, Libya, and maybe Cuba. This is likely the Army of Gog, and WW3 follows. China and Russia seem givens, as one is a poor ex-red state that secretly despises the West, and also happens to make weapons, the other a current red state that openly, yet passivly (economically) hates the West, has butt loads of money and wants to buy weapons. This will probably be easily noted by thier attack on Israel, and outwardly labeled the second seal by the big Biblical 'scholars' on tv, and in the churches around the world. Further, the color Red not only denotes war, bloodshed and violence, but possibly the political banner they (Russia and China) unite under.
Rev 6:5,6
3rd Seal - day 361 - 540: Black Horseman rides to spread famine. This famine could be caused intentionally by the red horseman and a possible nuclear attack, or by simply invading it's enemy countries and poisoning food supplies. The militias in Africa which use hunger and food control to gain leverage in thier regions are great examples of what a lack of food can do to a nation/s.
Rev 6:7,8
4th Seal - 541 - 720: Pale Horseman rolls out, and along comes the zombies, which is probably where a lot of people start to lose faith, since there is no mention of zombies in the Bible, and everyone insists the dead in Christ rise first. The zombies are a foreign idea to Biblical prophecy, as they are never considered an optio, but the greek translation of Revelation 6:8 doesn't include the word 'Hell', but rather, the word 'Hades', which is literally the land of the dead, the dead themselves, or the god of the dead. Either way, if Hades follows, you either have the physical manifestation of dead people over the foruth part fo the world, or massive posessions causing those who are infected (possibly a disease, oddly enough, see Land of the Dead, and a host of other zombie movies. lol), posessed, or otherwise effected to slaughter people in "The fourth part of the earth". The phrasing of this could mean either a certain part of the earth, as in the fourth part, or a literal quarter of the Earth, meaning the death of 1.5 billion people.
Rev 6:9-11
5th Seal - 721 - 900: Saints and Martyrs call out for justice, and from the way the scripture is written, it seems as though they have no clue what's going on, as most of that which has happened in the last 2 years has been all but unconceivable. But, those which are sealed are not yet 'home', so nothing changes, and nothing stops. God has a very concise list of people that are to be martyred and sent to the Kingdom, and until every single last soul on that list is received, bad times continue.
Rev 6:12-17, 7:1-17
6th Seal - 901 - 1080: Probable pole shift, noted by the new slant in the earth, causing a massive shift in the jet stream, causing gigantic storms, and earthquakes. The sun may turn black due to the authors perspective, or as a result of a massive ash cloud triggered by the possible volcanic activity caused by the earthquake, and volcanos along the pacific rim due to the probable pole shift. Continents may dislodge. Moon may turn red due to an ash cloud, or some change in Earth's upper atmosphere due to the massive climate change. "Stars falling" may suggest hot ash pellets raining on the surrounding areas. Re: Mt. Vesuvius. The wind no longer blows, and the horsemen stop thier ride, either from injury or because God had just scared thier masses into shock. God sends his messengers to seal the chosen people at night, see Ezekiel 9, which tells of the beginning of this undertaking in Jerusalem. At this point, the invaders from Iran, Sudan, Libya, and the rest of the Muslim world are slaughtered overnight, confounding the world, and further accentuating God's, and backing up the prophecy scholars and students.
Rev 8:1-5
7th Seal - 1081 - 1260: Everything stops. But wait! The fun hasn't even started yet!!! At this time, most should be utterly confused on Earth, and have no clue what's going on, having abandoned the prospect of Biblical prophecy after the zombies and premature stoppage of the one everyone thinks is the antichrist. Now is a time of profound confoundment, and shaky knees. There should be either a worldwide meteor shower, or even worse, 'aliens'. I know it sounds weird, but who else would the little guys in the disks be but the Nephilim?
-Trumpets-
Note: There are thunderings, voices, and lightenings, and finally, another earthquake. Probable date unk.
Rev 8:6,7
1st Trumpet - 1261 - 1440: Hmmm...hail and fire mingled with blood, and spread about the earth. Sounds like a supervolcano erupting. A third of the trees and all green grass are burnt. Yellowstone Caldera? Also, probable date of the Two Witnesses starting their ministry (Rev 11:1-13). The outer temple is given to the gentiles for 42 months, aka, 3.5 years during their ministry as a sanctuary, or possibly taken by seige by the enemy of God. Keep in mind, that neither the first nor the second beast kills the witnesses, but rather, the dragon from the pit. This is important, as it plays directly into the "dragon is antichrist", "beast is dragon" mindset the Roman church has shovel-fed the masses. This simply isn't so, and there is no scripture to support this doctrine.
Rev 8:8,9
2nd Trumpet - 1441 - 1620: Great, now a meteor hits a major body of water (No, not like a lake, like an OCEAN.), and kills a third of the fish, and sinks a third of the ships. This is obviously a meteor because, well, what else could a big chunk of rock slamming into the sea be? It ain't a teddy bear or a tricycle, I'll tell ya that. smile.gif
Rev 8:10,11
3rd Trumpet - 1621 - 1800: A comet, aptly named 'Wormwood' (Chernobyl in Russian), hits the source of a major water supply, a third of the rivers and streams are radiated, and a lot of people die from radiation poisoning. The difference between the two, the meteor and the comet, is composition. Meteors are comprised of rocks, metals, debris, and other hard materials, while comets are comprised mainly of frozen gasses, liquids, and other soft materials. The appearance of the meteor of the second trump being of fire, and the comet of the third trump being as a star, or lamp falls entirely on thier composition, and how either would react upon entering Earth's atmosphere. The windless environment of Earth after the sixth seal allows the radioactive (possibly) contamination of the comet Wormwood to stay in one confined area, and spread only through the water supply instead of creating worldwide fallout as it would in our current environmental status.
Rev 8:12,13
4th Trumpet - 1801 - 1980: Likely due to all of the debris (meteoric and comet blowback, supervolcanic ash) floating around in our windless upper atmosphere, the days are now 2/3 shorter than they were, and food is probably growing scarce. This may trigger a 'food is currency' system, and Ramen Noodles might be this year's gold. The darkness can be explained by the thickness of said debris in relation to the sun's angle to the sun. The debris floating about would seem thicker at the horizons due to the Earth's spherical shape, and the light would only be able to make it through when at a higher point from our perspective. Woe to the earth, because now, the gloves come off. The three woes follow.
Rev 9:1-12
FIRST WOE
5th Trumpet - 1981 - 2160: A star falls and opens 'the pit', releasing locust horses that hurt the non-sealed for 5 months. My theory: "Aliens" (At least that's what they'll be called, confirming Saganism), aka, the fallen angels of the rebellion in Heaven, return overtly, and 'put a whoopin on a vast majority of the people remaining on earth, except those whom God had sealed before the seventh seal. They just seem too strange sounding to be helicopters or mutant manmade clone dinosaurs or something. They are ruled by Abaddon, who is the angel of the bottomless pit, and appropriately, the hunter of mankind and destroyer of things good, righteous, cuddly, or otherwise genuinely pure and innocent. These five months will most likely convince the world that the sealed are in cahoots with the destroyer, as he can't hurt them. Perhaps the Persecution gets a kick start, and Christians become targets again for exclusion, suspicion, or even attempted genocide. I say attempted because at this point, and throughout the three woes, those sealed by God are protected for the first three warm up beatings the heathens are to receive. Basically, we just get to watch.
Rev 9:13-21, 10:1-7
SECOND WOE
6th Trumpet - 2161 - 2340: Four angels ruling over a combination of 200,000,000 troops go out to slay a third of the non-sealed men. The beasts ridden by these horsemen are like dragons with snakeheads on thier tails, that breathe fire, smoke and brimstone. Not only does a third of the remaining sinful men die, but more importanly, none of the sealed meet this fate, probably escalating the attempted violence against the sealed faithful remnant. By now, the remaining 2/3 of the sinful men are probably ENFURIATED at the sealed folks, and not only have disbelief in God, but a hatred for His followers. Also, an angel stands with his feet in both the sea and the land, and declares by He who lives forever and ever that there is "TIME NO MORE". I'm not sure if this means the Earth stops turning, or if it means that those who are lost now, are lost forever without Christ.
Rev: 10:3,4
SEVEN THUNDERS do thier thundering.
Rev: 11:15-19
THIRD WOE
7th Trumpet - 2341 - 2520: The seventh angel sounds, and Heaven becomes fricking VISIBLE, along with His ark and a bunch of lightening. It may not seem all that scary to those who are faithful, but to those who dedicated the last six and a half years to worshiping trees and little rocks and demons and stuff, this is terrifying. Also, the Witnesses die at the hand of the big red dragon. There is lightning, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail. Uh oh, the Witnesses woke up too (day 2523?), and ascended to Heaven, which really shocks all the newly God fearing people who now have PROOF, and a nice warm puddle of pee pee to stand in. They are now prepped to receive the false Christ.

Now, there is the swing time, when the world has just found out, unrefutably, that there is most certainly a God, and that all of the things that have happened have happened for as reason. Unfortunately, most people believe in a 7 year total trib and return concept, which was constructed by the very church that is to seize power during this time...the last standing physical church on earth, which still sits in ROME. I mean, who better to give the world advice than the 'Replacement of Jesus' (vicarius filii dei, the Popes literal title), since we just found out there is most certainly a God and all. This is all fine and dandy, because there is about to be a great sign in the heavens, and the antichrist is to come forward to start his overwhelming humanitarian work, and eventually proclaim himself the messiah at the head of both the Roman Catholic Church (The sun the woman is clothed in), and the Islamic faith (The moon at her feet.), and the twelve stars being the 'ascended masters of the twelve major world faiths which are to be combined into the final one world religion which are to be headed by the man child of the woman (church), which is the finalized apostate church. Don't get too excited, because now the giant red dragon is going to receive the rest of his whoopin that started some 14 thousand or so years ago from Michael, and the rest of God's angels. Oh yeah, and we all get to watch. At this time, God has softened everyone up, and everyone has either made up thier mind as to who they are behind, and who they support. There is purpose in the sealing of God's people wayyyyy back at the sixth seal, because they all still live on earth, and are henceforth exiled from the fake faith they refuse, along with the fake mark of the beast, which is the king of the New Roman Empire: The Crown Prince Merovignian of England!
(This is only MY guess, and rests entirely on his birthdate, name, previous humanitarian work, geographical location, religious claims, and bloodline)
WILLIAM V | VVIIIIAM V | I AM VIVIVI

Yeah, he'll be the right age (Same age as Jesus when He started His ministry) at this time, too. It should be either on his 30th birthday, or 180 days past, which is the beginning of the Mayan's and Egyptian's so called Golden Age: Day 2520, and end of the final trumpet. He'll be declaring himself 'Hamashiach' on day 3780 on his actual 33rd birthday, a scant 75 days from the vanishing on day 3855, at night. This is the date of the 'rapture' of the church, and the real cause for confusion, since it was supposed to happen some 7 years ago. From here, the final seven bowls of God's pissed-offed-ness gets dumped on the apostate church. Note, after the rapture, the only way to God is through martyrdom, and refusal of the mark of the beast. This beginning of the "Golden Age" is that which will confuse the very elect, as everyone insists that there is a seven year "from start to Jesus" tribulation. As soon as these seven years are up, and all of these amazing things have happened, along with the permanent banishment of the dragon from Heaven (Which will result in his desperation moves to follow, figuring if he can't be God, he'll damn all of God's people. The sealed know better.), all on Earth are going to assume that the next to stand up and claim to be Messiah will be He Himself, or Jesus Christ that is. It is this that will suck mankind into receiving the mark of the beast in thier forehead, which is the belief that this imposter is the Christ (faith), and in thier right hand, as they actively worship this phony (works). The sealed, knowing better, especially after the death and ressurection of the witnesses, will refuse and either be hunted down and killed for refusing to aknowledge him as Christ, or will live the next 75 days in absolute terror, not able to find shelter anywhere, or food and other staples.

The Bowls for Mr. Beasty Pants:

Bowl 1 - Boils...ya do't get much more straight forward here. Deep abcesses in the skin and maybe even internal organs. Excruciating pain and death from sepsis are likely companions. Pain is a certainty, which is known by anyone who's ever had a good sized boil. Yeah, now imagine that ALL OVER YOUR BODY. Painful? Psh, to say the least.

Bowl 2 - All water in the sea turns to blood, all fish die, and O2 is no longer as available as it was prior to, since a vast amount of oxygen is produced by ocean bound algae. The drop in oxygen triggers either a rapid dequantavolution in the health of men, animals, and plants, or forces everyone indoors to actually breathe properly.

Bowl 3- All potable water turns to blood. Yuck. I'm sure the smell's not all that great either once the sun starts to warm it up. Give it a week, and the WHOLE world will smell like a pool of blood on a hot day.

Bowl 4 - Ozone layer disappears, and horrific sunburns along with malignant malenomas help to hide the hideous boils. It probably hurts to breathe, move, or even think about now.

Bowl 5 - Babylon falls in a day, and darkness covers the beast's kingdom. Babylon is the capitol of the beast's kingdom, and likely the center for his operations. Like the Washington DC of the world. Lots of crying and gnashing of teeth follow, as this is unthinkable by those left on earth.

Bowl 6 - The beast pulls together his troops to make war against God at Harmeggido. The dragon, who has been very quiet since the end of the fight, along with the false prophet Mr. Imam Mahdi, and the antichrist dispatch three unclean spirits to call together the armies of the world to stand behind the beast.

Bowl 7 - Not only do they lose, but they get to deal with hundred pound hailstones too. Splat, beeatch.

Day 5040, the fate of everything is sealed, and the new kingdom is established. Any and all evil is exterminated, and no longer exists. The sealed, saints, martyrs, babies, and hopefully my golf clubs get to live with Jesus forever and ever in the New Jerusalem for a thousand years, or rather, a long, unending period of time, without need for food, or anything outside of faith alone and God's love.


Notes:

The First beast is the theopolitical system that is the new rome. It is headed by one, but given the form of a democracy, which is the purpose of the ten heads. After a small uprising, the antichrist absorbs three of the ten kingdoms, and becomes the 'little horn', placing his temporary throne in Brussels, until the new Rome is moved to Jerusalem on Day 3780. Amnongst those who will realize what's going on are people form all faiths who convert, and those apart of bastard Christianities like Mormonism, JW's, Catholics, Protestants, Dispensionalists, etc. that have no real basis in scriptural Christianity, and rely almost entirely on doctrine written by men.

The Second beast is the false prophet/s, which has two horns like a lamb. This not only means that they have the sound and appearance of peaceful and kind men, but that there are actually known most commonly as Imam Mahdi, and Maitreya, who are to go out and claim that Jesus (Played by Maitreya) was never crucified, and isn't the savior, and the 'real' savior is being brought in by this Imam Mahdi fellow. Essentially, Imam is pretending to be John the Baptist, and laying a path for little Willy boy as the 'real' Hamashiach. This Fake John will go about with Fake Jesus and apologize fraudulently for the 'misunderstanding'. These two will be called ascended masters, and will herald the comming of the one they will call the twelfth master, the messiah, lord and savior of the world. These acsended masters comprise the twelve stars surrounding the church's head, along with El Morya, Djwahl Khul, Hilarion, Mary, Nada, Serpis Bey, Racoksky, St. Germain, Paul the Venetian, and Khutumi, all of which are likely fallen angels of high rank underneath the fallen lucifer.

This image of the beast, which is given life, is actually a statue built to pass judgement on those unsealed few remaining before the rapture, which I will politely refer to as the 'fence sitting lucky folks who get to die martyrs' who are awarded with decapitation, or some other form of public execution. These are the only non-sealed (At the sixth seal) to enter into heaven, and they enter as martyrs either resisting, refusing, or defending others like themselves from the beast system. Beware, the two of the second beast will seem genuine and will do amazing things. Make no mistake, they are as dragons.

Magic exists, astrology works, and demons can be summoned. None-the-less, we are told not to practice any of them. So, wether they exist or not, do even think about it. It's not an option, and will cause you more trouble than it will save you from. Think: "LONG RUN". Eternity is a really long time.

-Ian Kouf
2:42am 20051213

PS - Rome says the Jews are correct in awaiting the Messiah. Keep that in Mind.

And that's my theoretical, hypothetical, rehtorical timeline which I wrote all by myself, based on 2 and a half years of constant obsession and compulsion to understand everything there is to understand on the subject of the enditmes and the mystery religion of the beast's kingdom. The faith is already pretty much built and only needs to be fleshed in by these events to gain validity amongst those to be decieved in the end time. The freemasons are to built the temple and have been holding these secrets, although a good 99.95% of them have no idea currently of that which they are apart of, since a key masonic doctrine is to lie to the initiate until it's determined that they can participate in the 33° Scottish Rite sharing of this secret. Thier key beliefs stem from Rosicrusianism, Theosophy (Helen Blavatsky, Alice Bailey, the foundation of the Ascended Masters theology), Kabbalah, and Apolloism, also commonly known as sun worship, Gematria, and other mystery faiths. The worship of light is most easily noted by light's properties, namely, the ability to be a constant straight line, and bend but never break, reflect but never move from a fixed point without outside stimuli. Basically, it's the measurement, and the masonic anchor for thier faith in Lucifer.

(Written listening to winamp channel: Bebop 24x7...get on it for the best jazz around.)

That concludes my theoretical, common-sensical interpretation of Revelation from a lay term standpoint. Please, take time to flip through your Bible and compare the points noted. I feel pretty strongly that this is a more realisitic version, not based on science, but oddly enough, based on my gut instinct, and drive to write it. I spent three months working on it, and started after more than 2 years of research on the NWO, mystery religions, and other factors supports in the antichrist and beast system. I don't want to point fingers at any gorup of people, but rather doctrines and chruches, because while I don't think Catholics worship the devil on purpose, I do think they worship Apollo everytime they go to mass, even though they think they're worshipping Jesus Christ. I try to look at it from Jesus' point of view; hate the sin, love the sinner. Afterall, noones perfect, and even the most hardcore atheist is going to be converted in His light, and even the most devout Muslim will drop his koran and follow in His glory when He returns, so please, don't take it as passing judgement, take it as what I consider forewarning, to save some people the confusion they might face. I hope you enjoyed the timeline, and found it at least interesting. In summary - Seals - 3.5 years, Trumpets - 3.5 years, antichrist setting up kingdom - 3.5 years, antichrist setting himself up as god and getting a serious sapnking from the real God, 3.5 years.

Thank you for your time, and God bless you. smile.gif
wub.gif Your brother in Christ,
everwatchful
Simple
QUOTE
Given what we know wbout the Bible, and Biblical prophecy, what could possibly hapen that would deceive the very elect?


Isn't the deception signs and wonders ?

Doesn't the Antichrist have incredible 'magic' powers , including bringing down fire from heaven ?

A Satanist on television persuaded 6 ordinary law abiding citizens to stage an armed robbery , believing it for real .

The Age of Lawlessness is here .

The Restrainer is fast removing .

Jesus didn't restrain Satan from putting out the LIE about the miners .
People now doubt God .

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Also , as long as the bible is sufficiently corrupted , then the Benchmark for Truth gets lost in the sand .

We are not as highminded and rational as you think ......we are sheep seeking a shepherd
everwatchful
In regards to the miners, from what I understand, it was a miscommunication, which was stated as, "We got 12", and it was taken, "We got 12 alive".

As for the signs and wonders, would you, or any other Christian who's read the Book f revelation actually fall for it, just because someone showed ya some miracles? I've found a pretty fool proof way to tell who's fake and who's genuine, as far as the Messiah goes:

Ask him what your name is. Not your given name; your real name. The name on the little white stone that only God and you will know. Names are very important, as the proper name gives one control over someone, according to the Hebrews. That's why God's name is stated as YHVH, and not the whole name, because to say His name is to claim dominion over Him. If he, whoever it is at the time, claims to be the messiah, and he doesn't know your name, the preexistant name of your soul, he's a phony. Only Jesus Christ knows that name.

The signs and wonders, in my opinion, will be the war in heaven witnessed by the world after the seventh trump. The fact that we all watch satan get thrown down to earth, first off, and secondly, maybe this golden boy we call the antichrist will 'banish' him somewhere. I don't know how anyone would trust the guy if the dragon fell down to earth in permanent defeat, and was allowed to live, at least through general appearance, amongst mankind. Remeber, the dragon still exists durring the sixth vial of God's wrath to send out his evil frog spirit with the ac and false prophet, so he's not actually gone. Perhaps the signs and wonders that fool everyone is what everone expects Christ to do after seven years of intense calamity. Perhaps the antichrist appears to send his father to hell in front of every man on earth, and the fallen angel takes a dive to establish his kingdom on earth.

Really, the whole point I'm trying to make is, we take everyhting we know from those before us, and really, who knows what their motives are. Who knows what the dispensionalists were thinking...or the mormons, etc. We have no way of knowing, so it only makes sense to me that we sit down, start fresh from page one of the last days, and really look at it objectively, with no preconceived notions of what's going to happen based on what someone else has said in the past, unless that person is Jesus Christ or St. John. I propose a full overhaul of prophecy with no denominational bias or point of view is all. I think we owe it to ourselves, our children, and our brothers and sisters to really take a serious look at it, and try to squash all room for error. The name idea, for example. Use things that only God the Father and His Son knows. Use things contrary to satan's nature, which he finds unescapable, such as his pride, ego, or hatred for mankind. Use something, but for God's sake, don't just take the same old theory, based on someone who claimed to be a prophet, and take it as Gospel, when in reality, it has more to do with personal slant and dogma than anyhting. Lots of people come in His name, and more will in the future. We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe.

It's the very reason why I'm open to suggestions. It's an unofficial timeline for the very purpose of changing it if I've been wrong somewhere. I've already edited it several times, but based only on scripture. If you see something amiss, or otherwise misleading, please, tell me.

everwatchful
everwatchful
I truly expected more resistance to the idea, and not such a drop and ignore reaction. I'm just bumping my thread back to the top. I know, it's shameless and self promoting, but I'm not perfect, and frankly, I worked on this for three months and want people to read it. Pray for me and my selfishness.
HGFireHazard
Well I would say it was an interesting read for sure. I don't know as much as many individuals do on these forums, and I don't know as much about the Bible as I would like to either. However, I think it is pretty safe to say that we really don't have any idea other than exactly what is written in God's word. We can predict and estimate and presume until these things come to pass, but we won't know until they happen.
Tomcat
QUOTE(everwatchful @ Jan 5 2006, 08:08 PM)
In regards to the miners, from what I understand, it was a miscommunication, which was stated as, "We got 12", and it was taken, "We got 12 alive".

As for the signs and wonders, would you, or any other Christian who's read the Book f revelation actually fall for it, just because someone showed ya some miracles? I've found a pretty fool proof way to tell who's fake and who's genuine, as far as the Messiah goes:

Ask him what your name is. Not your given name; your real name. The name on the little white stone that only God and you will know. Names are very important, as the proper name gives one control over someone, according to the Hebrews. That's why God's name is stated as YHVH, and not the whole name, because to say His name is to claim dominion over Him. If he, whoever it is at the time, claims to be the messiah, and he doesn't know your name, the preexistant name of your soul, he's a phony. Only Jesus Christ knows that name.

The signs and wonders, in my opinion, will be the war in heaven witnessed by the world after the seventh trump. The fact that we all watch satan get thrown down to earth, first off, and secondly, maybe this golden boy we call the antichrist will 'banish' him somewhere. I don't know how anyone would trust the guy if the dragon fell down to earth in permanent defeat, and was allowed to live, at least through general appearance, amongst mankind. Remeber, the dragon still exists durring the sixth vial of God's wrath to send out his evil frog spirit with the ac and false prophet, so he's not actually gone. Perhaps the signs and wonders that fool everyone is what everone expects Christ to do after seven years of intense calamity. Perhaps the antichrist appears to send his father to hell in front of every man on earth, and the fallen angel takes a dive to establish his kingdom on earth.

Really, the whole point I'm trying to make is, we take everyhting we know from those before us, and really, who knows what their motives are. Who knows what the dispensionalists were thinking...or the mormons, etc. We have no way of knowing, so it only makes sense to me that we sit down, start fresh from page one of the last days, and really look at it objectively, with no preconceived notions of what's going to happen based on what someone else has said in the past, unless that person is Jesus Christ or St. John. I propose a full overhaul of prophecy with no denominational bias or point of view is all. I think we owe it to ourselves, our children, and our brothers and sisters to really take a serious look at it, and try to squash all room for error. The name idea, for example. Use things that only God the Father and His Son knows. Use things contrary to satan's nature, which he finds unescapable, such as his pride, ego, or hatred for mankind. Use something, but for God's sake, don't just take the same old theory, based on someone who claimed to be a prophet, and take it as Gospel, when in reality, it has more to do with personal slant and dogma than anyhting. Lots of people come in His name, and more will in the future. We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe.

It's the very reason why I'm open to suggestions. It's an unofficial timeline for the very purpose of changing it if I've been wrong somewhere. I've already edited it several times, but based only on scripture. If you see something amiss, or otherwise misleading, please, tell me.

everwatchful
[right][snapback]31841[/snapback][/right]


Brothers and Sisters in Christ, and those seeking,
Truth to us all through the LORD Jesus Christ.

everwatchful,
In an earlier post than the one above you asked..
"Given what we know wbout the Bible, and Biblical prophecy, what could possibly hapen that would deceive the very elect?"

The answer is NOTHING.
Mat.24:24
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs
and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible
-(but it's not)-they shall deceive the very elect.

Above, you wrote..
"don't just take the same old theory, based on someone who claimed to be a prophet, and take it as Gospel, when in reality, it has more to do with personal slant and dogma than anyhting. Lots of people come in His name, and more will in the future. We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe."

I agree. We are in the last of the last days so the prophesies of Jesus about false
prophets coming in his name (Mat.24:5,11,24) is being fulfilled today..even on this forum.
The ONLY way not to be deceived by these false prophets is to hear the voice of
Jesus and be taught by the Holy Spirit.
Most of them are easy for me to spot but some of them are VERY crafty and subtle. Nevertheless, Jesus has been and always will be faithful to keep me
and the other elect in the Light of Truth. Praise be to His Holy name.
Jesus said, "Have faith in God"
Those that don't have faith in God but put their faith in men..ie. churches, web sites, books(other than the Bible), and even forums such as this, etc... for truth
will not get the truth but will be sent a strong *delusion(error), that they should believe a lie. 2Thes.2:11
Why???
because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 2Thes.2:10

A couple of weeks ago Jesus allowed me to witness the gospel to a fellow worker.
God was really speaking to this young man and right toward the end of about 2 1/2
hours of sharing the truth of Jesus with him Jesus revealed something to me and
had me ask him the question.
There is ONE thing that is common with every single true Christian. Do you know what it is?
He couldn't answer the question. Can you?

The one thing that is common with every true Christian no matter who they are or where they come from or what their background is that THEY LOVE THE TRUTH.

Do you want to hear the voice of Jesus and be taught by the Holy Spirit? Then you
have to LOVE THE TRUTH with your whole mind, your whole heart, and with ALL of
your strength. Man's opinions.."I believe" or "it seems to me" or "maybe it means
this" or "it appears" or "I've heard it preached" or "I suppose" or "It looks like" or
"Reason would say" or "it's my understanding", etc.. are all preface remarks of
those groping in darkness trying to figure out the Truth of God's word rather than
deligently seeking Him by faith to be taught of Him. Rather than studying God's
word for themselves and being taught by Him they heap to themselves teachers.
The elect enjoy reasoning with one another in the Holy word under the unction of
the Holy Spirit while others are 'ever learning' but never coming to the knowledge of the truth.
Let your yay be yay and your nay be nay.

As everwatchful stated above..
"We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe."
AMEN.

Mat.4:4b-
It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.


Peace, Tom
C
Tom, if you carry on with this, you will find yourself soon grinding this axe somewhere else. Please consider this your first warning.If a second one is necessary, you will go back to your previous status, where your posts will be monitored.
Cornelius
everwatchful
Well, I see what you're saying, but the way I look at it is that it's MEANT to be understood, this book in particular. Revelation has certain parts of it which make it understood that the following phrase is meant to be understood by those with wisdom, for example the number of the beast. It doesn't necessarily mean the whole book is that way, otherwise it would never differentiate between the lay term areas, which I see as making up a majority of the book, and the hidden areas that require study, and years of brainstorming different ideas. If it were meant to be mysterious and hard to understand, like I said before, it would hardly be called a Revelation, because what does a riddle reveal but confusion and confoundment? It's meant to be understandable by even children, and people as dumb as I am that take three months to do a weeks worth of study. I'm not a genius, but when I look at it, it makes sense to me.

Most of the calamaties that occur can be explained in very sensical, realisitic points of view, like the meteor, comet, and etc. Some things are called what they are because there isn't a word for it yet. Take for instance the Ninth chapter of Ezekiel. Then 6 men, which had "slaughter weapons" in their hands. Now, if those were swords, they'd have been called, outright, swords. If they were axes, they'd have been named such. But the wording suggests that the author had no clue what they were, but knew only that they were weapons which would slaughter man. Hence, "slaughter weapons". Ya think Saint John the Divine knew what a comet was? Or a meteor? A supervolcano would have been a mystery to him, since seeing one meant that you were dead. Most of the things described are things we know of with somewhat commonality nowadays, but those same things would have been mysteries to someone a thousand years ago. Heck, even two hundred years ago. So, don't fret just because it all seems overwhelming, or confusing, just remember, if you weren't meant to understand what these things were, it would be called something other than Revelation.

Also, I'm not married to any of those ideas. It's an unofficial theoretical timeline, which, based on current events in Israel, could easily see the replacing of the EU version of the white horseman with a Likud version of it. If a right wing Israeli took over power in Israel, and booted the Palestinians out of Gaza and the West Bank, I could see a red hose being easily forseeable in the following months, in the form of the Islamic states backed by red China and maybe even Russia. Ta-Da, Gog.

Just saying, it's all very fluid still, and doesn't need to be taken literally. The scenario isn't as important to me as the layout. I've taken into consideration the Newage, Islam, and other Mystery religions which are to profit from the reign of the antichrist, and from a linear start to finish perspective, I've formulated my theory to the best of my intellectual ability, taking as little out of the Word and injecting as little as possible by way of my personal opinion.

By the way, thanks for the response. I'm glad people are reading it. smile.gif

Ian
everwatchful
Cornelius, thanks for sticking up for me, but it really doesn't bother me. I've taken worse for my little brainchild. Tom, relax man, I'm not trying to argue, just trying to share my point of view. We all have a different POV, even though we read the same Book. Some are pretrib, other post trib, others gap theorists, and others even think that everyhting already happened and is happening, and all we have left to do is welcome Jesus Christ back to earth. It's all difference of opinion, but what we all agree on is that Jesus Christ is our Lord and Saviour, and as long as we're on that same page, we're ok.
Adstar
QUOTE(Tomcat @ Jan 9 2006, 07:12 PM)
QUOTE(everwatchful @ Jan 5 2006, 08:08 PM)
In regards to the miners, from what I understand, it was a miscommunication, which was stated as, "We got 12", and it was taken, "We got 12 alive".

As for the signs and wonders, would you, or any other Christian who's read the Book f revelation actually fall for it, just because someone showed ya some miracles? I've found a pretty fool proof way to tell who's fake and who's genuine, as far as the Messiah goes:

Ask him what your name is. Not your given name; your real name. The name on the little white stone that only God and you will know. Names are very important, as the proper name gives one control over someone, according to the Hebrews. That's why God's name is stated as YHVH, and not the whole name, because to say His name is to claim dominion over Him. If he, whoever it is at the time, claims to be the messiah, and he doesn't know your name, the preexistant name of your soul, he's a phony. Only Jesus Christ knows that name.

The signs and wonders, in my opinion, will be the war in heaven witnessed by the world after the seventh trump. The fact that we all watch satan get thrown down to earth, first off, and secondly, maybe this golden boy we call the antichrist will 'banish' him somewhere. I don't know how anyone would trust the guy if the dragon fell down to earth in permanent defeat, and was allowed to live, at least through general appearance, amongst mankind. Remeber, the dragon still exists durring the sixth vial of God's wrath to send out his evil frog spirit with the ac and false prophet, so he's not actually gone. Perhaps the signs and wonders that fool everyone is what everone expects Christ to do after seven years of intense calamity. Perhaps the antichrist appears to send his father to hell in front of every man on earth, and the fallen angel takes a dive to establish his kingdom on earth.

Really, the whole point I'm trying to make is, we take everyhting we know from those before us, and really, who knows what their motives are. Who knows what the dispensionalists were thinking...or the mormons, etc. We have no way of knowing, so it only makes sense to me that we sit down, start fresh from page one of the last days, and really look at it objectively, with no preconceived notions of what's going to happen based on what someone else has said in the past, unless that person is Jesus Christ or St. John. I propose a full overhaul of prophecy with no denominational bias or point of view is all. I think we owe it to ourselves, our children, and our brothers and sisters to really take a serious look at it, and try to squash all room for error. The name idea, for example. Use things that only God the Father and His Son knows. Use things contrary to satan's nature, which he finds unescapable, such as his pride, ego, or hatred for mankind. Use something, but for God's sake, don't just take the same old theory, based on someone who claimed to be a prophet, and take it as Gospel, when in reality, it has more to do with personal slant and dogma than anyhting. Lots of people come in His name, and more will in the future. We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe.

It's the very reason why I'm open to suggestions. It's an unofficial timeline for the very purpose of changing it if I've been wrong somewhere. I've already edited it several times, but based only on scripture. If you see something amiss, or otherwise misleading, please, tell me.

everwatchful
[right][snapback]31841[/snapback][/right]


Brothers and Sisters in Christ, and those seeking,
Truth to us all through the LORD Jesus Christ.

everwatchful,
In an earlier post than the one above you asked..
"Given what we know wbout the Bible, and Biblical prophecy, what could possibly hapen that would deceive the very elect?"

The answer is NOTHING.
Mat.24:24
For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall show great signs
and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible
-(but it's not)-they shall deceive the very elect.

Above, you wrote..
"don't just take the same old theory, based on someone who claimed to be a prophet, and take it as Gospel, when in reality, it has more to do with personal slant and dogma than anyhting. Lots of people come in His name, and more will in the future. We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe."

I agree. We are in the last of the last days so the prophesies of Jesus about false
prophets coming in his name (Mat.24:5,11,24) is being fulfilled today..even on this forum.
The ONLY way not to be deceived by these false prophets is to hear the voice of
Jesus and be taught by the Holy Spirit.
Most of them are easy for me to spot but some of them are VERY crafty and subtle. Nevertheless, Jesus has been and always will be faithful to keep me
and the other elect in the Light of Truth. Praise be to His Holy name.
Jesus said, "Have faith in God"
Those that don't have faith in God but put their faith in men..ie. churches, web sites, books(other than the Bible), and even forums such as this, etc... for truth
will not get the truth but will be sent a strong *delusion(error), that they should believe a lie. 2Thes.2:11
Why???
because they received not the love of the truth, that they might be saved. 2Thes.2:10

A couple of weeks ago Jesus allowed me to witness the gospel to a fellow worker.
God was really speaking to this young man and right toward the end of about 2 1/2
hours of sharing the truth of Jesus with him Jesus revealed something to me and
had me ask him the question.
There is ONE thing that is common with every single true Christian. Do you know what it is?
He couldn't answer the question. Can you?

The one thing that is common with every true Christian no matter who they are or where they come from or what their background is that THEY LOVE THE TRUTH.

Do you want to hear the voice of Jesus and be taught by the Holy Spirit? Then you
have to LOVE THE TRUTH with your whole mind, your whole heart, and with ALL of
your strength. Man's opinions.."I believe" or "it seems to me" or "maybe it means
this" or "it appears" or "I've heard it preached" or "I suppose" or "It looks like" or
"Reason would say" or "it's my understanding", etc.. are all preface remarks of
those groping in darkness trying to figure out the Truth of God's word rather than
deligently seeking Him by faith to be taught of Him. Rather than studying God's
word for themselves and being taught by Him they heap to themselves teachers.
The elect enjoy reasoning with one another in the Holy word under the unction of
the Holy Spirit while others are 'ever learning' but never coming to the knowledge of the truth.
Let your yay be yay and your nay be nay.

As everwatchful stated above..
"We have to be ready and allow for no doubt when it comes to what we'll believe."
AMEN.

Mat.4:4b-
It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.


Peace, Tom
[right][snapback]32614[/snapback][/right]


Good to see you posting Tom. smile.gif

I agree with you the secret to the blessings of wisdom from God is embracing the Love of The Truth... Jesus. Believing Jesus opens the blessings of God to us.

One thing, people can introduce thoughts without knowing if they come from God or they come from their own thinking. Its like throwing a thought out there for other brothers and sisters in Jesus to review. The danger comes when people say "this is what it means" without actually knowing this is what it means. Often the best way to get yourself corrected is to give everything you have got and let others attempt to straighten you out.


All Praise The Ancient Of Days
Tzeitel
What was wrong with Toms post??? unsure.gif
C
"Most of them are easy for me to spot but some of them are VERY crafty and subtle. Nevertheless, Jesus has been and always will be faithful to keep me
and the other elect in the Light of Truth. Praise be to His Holy name."

Tom knows what I am talking about.
C
Tzeitel
Oh righty, ok... huh.gif
Miki
Just because people read books or post on forums doesn't mean they put their "faith" in them Tom.

Your digs are insulting to the intelligence of the honest forthright people on this forum who want to fellowship, exchange view points, opinions and personal experiences here.

I'm open to learn but not from somebody who is so so sure he knows it all.

We prophecy in part...In part...Get it?

If someone is speaking and somebody else has a revelation then the first one sits down and the second one continues. God works with the whole body and that's why he wants everybody to prophesy. He wants us to desire it.

He wants all the parts to work together.

You aren't an ear...it's very clear..but can you hear?

biggrin.gif

New testament prophets hear in part...Agabus was a case in point.

I don't know what body part you are because l don't know you very well but maybe you'd care to tell us or others who know you better might venture a guess.
Tomcat
Brothers and Sisters in Christ, and those seeking,
Grace and Peace to all through the LORD Jesus Christ.

Cornelius,
you wrote..
"Tom, if you carry on with this, you will find yourself soon grinding this axe somewhere else. Please consider this your first warning.If a second one is necessary, you will go back to your previous status, where your posts will be monitored.
Cornelius"


If I carry on with what? Proclaiming the truth as Jesus has given it to me? You are
WRONG in your assumption that my post was directed at one particular person. The words I wrote are the truth. That's what I Love. The Truth. Jesus is the Truth.
The Word of God is Jesus. It is Jesus..the Truth that has set me free. In Him I live and move and have my being. I hear His voice and I'm accountable to Him to faithfully give away that which He has given me or risk Him not giving me anymore and taking even that which He has given me. Luke 8:18 Jesus has told me to "Feed my lambs and sheep" John 21:15-17

My comments were words of admonition for ALL and many fit the bill.
Did I write something that wasn't true? If so, why don't you show me with scripture
what I wrote that was wrong or untrue rather than threatening me with moderation or being banned for something you THINK??? I'm doing. As a moderator you are in a very delicate positon. My counsel to you and all moderators that you take heed of your power that you not be found fighting against the ordinance of God. Romans 13:1,2

My Love Jesus, for this forum, and the people on it is reflected by the truth which I post for it is the rightly divided counsel of God.

To all others..
I am sorry that I don't have time, Sarah, Ian, Adstar, and Miki right now but I will
reply (God willing) to your posts later tonight when I get home from work.

Much Love in Jesus to all,

Peace, Tom
Tomcat
Brothers and Sisters in Christ, and those seeking,
Grace and Peace to all through the LORD Jesus Christ.

Cornelius,
you wrote..
"Tom, if you carry on with this, you will find yourself soon grinding this axe somewhere else. Please consider this your first warning.If a second one is necessary, you will go back to your previous status, where your posts will be monitored.
Cornelius"


If I carry on with what? Proclaiming the truth as Jesus has given it to me? You are
WRONG in your assumption that my post was directed at one particular person. The words I wrote are the truth. That's what I Love. The Truth. Jesus is the Truth.
The Word of God is Jesus. It is Jesus..the Truth that has set me free. In Him I live and move and have my being. I hear His voice and I'm accountable to Him to faithfully give away that which He has given me or risk Him not giving me anymore and taking even that which He has given me. Luke 8:18 Jesus has told me to "Feed my lambs and sheep" John 21:15-17

My comments were words of admonition for ALL and many fit the bill.
Did I write something that wasn't true? If so, why don't you show me with scripture
what I wrote that was wrong or untrue rather than threatening me with moderation or being banned for something you THINK??? I'm doing. As a moderator you are in a very delicate positon. My counsel to you and all moderators that you take heed of your power that you not be found fighting against the ordinance of God. Romans 13:1,2

My Love fo Jesus, for this forum, and the people on it is reflected by the truth which I post for it is the rightly divided counsel of God.

To all others..
I am sorry that I don't have time, Sarah, Ian, Adstar, and Miki right now but I will
reply (God willing) to your posts later tonight when I get home from work.

Much Love in Jesus to all,

Peace, Tom
RosielovesJesus
Tomcat, I must say in your defense, not sure you need one because God was speaking through you. I felt nothing wrong with what you said. I thought it was
straight for the Lord. I really did!

God bless you.
kim48
QUOTE(Tomcat @ Jan 9 2006, 02:29 PM)
Brothers and Sisters in Christ, and those seeking,
Grace and Peace to all through the LORD Jesus Christ.

Cornelius,
you wrote..
"Tom, if you carry on with this, you will find yourself soon grinding this axe somewhere else. Please consider this your first warning.If a second one is necessary, you will go back to your previous status, where your posts will be monitored.
Cornelius"


If I carry on with what?  Proclaiming the truth as Jesus has given it to me? You are
WRONG in your assumption that my post was directed at one particular person. The words I wrote are the truth. That's what I Love. The Truth. Jesus is the Truth.
The Word of God is Jesus. It is Jesus..the Truth that has set me free. In Him I live and move and have my being. I hear His voice and I'm accountable to Him to faithfully give away that which He has given me or risk Him not giving me anymore and taking even that which He has given me. Luke 8:18 Jesus has told me to "Feed my lambs and sheep" John 21:15-17

My comments were words of admonition for ALL and many fit the bill.
Did I write something that wasn't true? If so, why don't you show me with scripture
what I wrote that was wrong or untrue rather than threatening me with moderation or being banned for something you THINK??? I'm doing. As a moderator you are in a very delicate positon. My counsel to you and all moderators that you take heed of your power that you not be found fighting against the ordinance of God. Romans 13:1,2

My Love fo Jesus, for this forum, and the people on it is reflected by the truth which I post for it is the rightly divided counsel of God.

To all others..
I am sorry that I don't have time, Sarah, Ian, Adstar, and Miki right now but I will
reply (God willing) to your posts later tonight when I get home from work.

Much Love in Jesus to all,

Peace, Tom
[right][snapback]32771[/snapback][/right]



Tomcat
We will not argue or debate with you. If one moderater says something than we are all in agreement.
So please we ask you nicely.
Kim
Pamela
Lord keep the peace here and let your work be done.
Lord you are not the author of confusion, show the truth.
shy1
QUOTE(Tomcat @ Jan 9 2006, 02:12 AM)
Do you want to hear the voice of Jesus and be taught by the Holy Spirit? Then you
have to LOVE THE TRUTH with your whole mind, your whole heart, and with ALL of
your strength. Man's opinions.."I believe" or "it seems to me" or "maybe it means
this" or "it appears" or "I've heard it preached" or "I suppose" or "It looks like" or
"Reason would say" or "it's my understanding", etc.. are all preface remarks of
those groping in darkness trying to figure out the Truth of God's word rather than
deligently seeking Him by faith to be taught of Him. Rather than studying God's
word for themselves and being taught by Him they heap to themselves teachers.
The elect enjoy reasoning with one another in the Holy word under the unction of
the Holy Spirit while others are 'ever learning' but never coming to the knowledge of the truth.
Let your yay be yay and your nay be nay.

Mat.4:4b-
It is written, That man shall not live by bread alone, but by every word that proceedeth out of the mouth of God.


Peace, Tom
[right][snapback]32614[/snapback][/right]


I know Tom took some flak for the above, but I really like the reminder. We can heap up to ourselves teachers (the wrong ones if we're not careful) and still never come to the knowledge of the truth. The Holy Spirit needs to be our guide in all our learning and all our seeking for truth. He is the only one who can lead us to the truth. We can even fail to learn what's in the scriptures if we don't have the guidance of the Spirit--ten different people can "prove" ten different, conflicting points from the scriptures (on some things, yes), if you aren't judging by the Spirit.

I mentioned in another post recently that I was raised by Presbyterian/Southern Baptist parents. I definitely had no clue that there were all kind of people out there who were calling themselves prophets. To tell you the truth, I really only became aware of it after joining this forum and seeing some of their things posted here. I've gone to lots of different websites that people have mentioned and googled lots of names, and it's been a real awakening to me about what's going on in the rest of the world (outside of my house). Some of the stuff makes sense to me, and some of it doesn't, and it really requires a lot of discernment these days to weed out the true from the false. Not everybody out there who claims to be a prophet can possibly be speaking for God every time they put something out on the internet.

I was raised with the idea that the Bible was written, and that's all there is. If it isn't in the Bible, God didn't want us to know it. (Kind of what Cornelius expressed recently in I forgot which thread.) Revelation from God had certainly stopped with the Bible, and there were scriptures in Deuteronomy and in Revelation that said if you added to that, God would condemn you for it. That's especially the Southern Baptist part of my upbringing.

Then I come to the forum and hear people like Dave Hunt (and others) quoted a lot, and somebody said that they thought he had actually heard the audible voice of God. I thought, "Well, that would be revelation, and if it were written down, it would be scripture." And people are ok with that, and with all these prophets of today and what they write. So I guess revelation has NOT ceased, and scripture could still be written. Do you see where this is going? David? Tom?

Can somebody tell me the difference between finding Dave Hunt and his spiritually prompted writing to be acceptable and these prophets that are all over the internet to be acceptable and NOT the extra scriptures of some churches to be acceptable, because they are in addition to the Bible? Is not all of this stuff in addition to the Bible?
shy1
QUOTE(everwatchful @ Jan 8 2006, 06:17 AM)
I truly expected more resistance to the idea, and not such a drop and ignore reaction. I'm just bumping my thread back to the top. I know, it's shameless and self promoting, but I'm not perfect, and frankly, I worked on this for three months and want people to read it. Pray for me and my selfishness.
[right][snapback]32438[/snapback][/right]


Suggesting 14 years instead of 7 makes it look like God intends to set people up to be tricked into accepting the a/c when they were expecting the Savior by that time. More people would be fooled by the a/c and take the mark of the beast. 14 years would be much harder on people, both believers and those who need to be persuaded to believe, especially since everyone is expecting 7 years. 7 years of tribulation is rough enough and few enough will make it, and I have a hard time accepting the idea of God extending it to 14 to make the a/c look even more like the real thing. I would think He would want MORE people to make it, not FEWER. Just my $.02
C
Shy
I think if you have a prophecy from somebody, God tells us to judge it. We can then decide to take it into our spirit or not. We look to the Word when we do that.
I have problems when a prophecy comes my way and tells me what is going to happen to me. If God has been speaking to me saying :"I want you to go to Israel" and a prophet say later to me "I feel God is speaking to you about Israel" I will take it as confirmation. I want to have the Word first, then the confirmation.

And I don't believe in additions to the Bible. The Word must confirm every prophecy. But like Miki said, the prophets prophecy in part, therefore you have to rely on the Holy Spirit to help you discern.
C
shy1
QUOTE(everwatchful @ Jan 5 2006, 03:03 AM)
Now, there is the swing time, when the world has just found out, unrefutably, that there is most certainly a God, and that all of the things that have happened have happened for as reason. Unfortunately, most people believe in a 7 year total trib and return concept, which was constructed by the very church that is to seize power during this time...the last standing physical church on earth, which still sits in ROME. I mean, who better to give the world advice than the 'Replacement of Jesus' (vicarius filii dei, the Popes literal title), since we just found out there is most certainly a God and all. This is all fine and dandy, because there is about to be a great sign in the heavens, and the antichrist is to come forward to start his overwhelming humanitarian work, and eventually proclaim himself the messiah at the head of both the Roman Catholic Church (The sun the woman is clothed in), and the Islamic faith (The moon at her feet.), and the twelve stars being the 'ascended masters of the twelve major world faiths which are to be combined into the final one world religion which are to be headed by the man child of the woman (church), which is the finalized apostate church. Don't get too excited, because now the giant red dragon is going to receive the rest of his  whoopin that started some 14 thousand or so years ago from Michael, and the rest of God's angels. Oh yeah, and we all get to watch. At this time, God has softened everyone up, and everyone has either made up thier mind as to who they are behind, and who they support. There is purpose in the sealing of God's people wayyyyy back at the sixth seal, because they all still live on earth, and are henceforth exiled from the fake faith they refuse, along with the fake mark of the beast, which is the king of the New Roman Empire: The Crown Prince Merovignian of England!
(This is only MY guess, and rests entirely on his birthdate, name, previous humanitarian work, geographical location, religious claims, and bloodline)
WILLIAM V | VVIIIIAM V | I AM VIVIVI

The Second beast is the false prophet/s, which has two horns like a lamb. This not only means that they have the sound and appearance of peaceful and kind men, but that there are actually known most commonly as Imam Mahdi, and Maitreya, who are to go out and claim that Jesus (Played by Maitreya) was never crucified, and isn't the savior, and the 'real' savior is being brought in by this Imam Mahdi fellow. Essentially, Imam is pretending to be John the Baptist, and laying a path for little Willy boy as the 'real' Hamashiach. This Fake John will go about with Fake Jesus and apologize fraudulently for the 'misunderstanding'. These two will be called ascended masters, and will herald the comming of the one they will call the twelfth master, the messiah, lord and savior of the world. These acsended masters comprise the twelve stars surrounding the church's head, along with El Morya, Djwahl Khul, Hilarion, Mary, Nada, Serpis Bey, Racoksky, St. Germain, Paul the Venetian, and Khutumi, all of which are likely fallen angels of high rank underneath the fallen lucifer.

Thank you for your time, and God bless you. smile.gif
wub.gif Your brother in Christ,
everwatchful
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This was a long read . . .
One of these "ascended masters" names looked familiar, so I googled it. I learned a lot about this topic by googling "ascended master nada." They even have our Savior listed as an "ascended master!" How insulting! That is alongside other "ascended masters such as Lady Nada: "Ascended Lady Master Nada is Chohan of the Sixth Ray, the purple and gold ray, of peace, service and brotherhood. She tutors souls in mastering these qualities in the solar-plexus chakra, and helps them prepare to receive the Holy Spirit’s gifts of speaking in tongues and interpretation of tongues. In addition, she is known as the unifier of families and twin flames. The word Nada means the voice of the silence, and also a receding of the personality into the nothingness, giving way to the Christ Self. Nada is a Messenger of the Lord Meru and received training in His retreat. She is of the Third Ray. Nada has a certain cosmic authority for the incoming age. Healing is one of Her actions or services to mankind. She is one Who directs healing to the mankind of Earth. She uses a Pink Flame for some of Her work. Nada is a member of the Karmic Board and represents the Third Ray in that body. She has recently assumed the Chohanship for the Sixth Ray for the time being. Her symbol is a pink rose."

I take it this New Age nonsense is actually accepted out there? And apparently it is accepted by those who will support the a/c? It really made me angry to read about some of the other ones who supposedly gave power to Jesus while He was on the earth--this whole thing really trivializes Him, and in that you can see it for the tool of Satan that it is. Yes, I can see the a/c using that kind of thing. Set up all these others as equal to the real Lord and Savior and see if people will accept them, too. It really is sickening. Ok, I'll get off this now.

I'm not knocking you, everwatchful--not at all. I don't doubt that you have a valid point about all that new age stuff being part of the picture. It just made me sick once I looked it up. I'm thankful for my sheltered life! But it's not going to be sheltered for much longer, is it?! unsure.gif wacko.gif
RosielovesJesus
This new age stuff is creeping in everywhere.
Oh Lord keep us in the right path.
The devil is trying everything he can to confuse us.

Let us all stay in the word and pray without ceasing.
God be with us-He will show us the way.

We surely have to discern everything anymore.
choirgirl
QUOTE(RosielovesJesus @ Jan 9 2006, 05:09 PM)
This new age stuff is creeping in everywhere.
Oh Lord keep us in the right path.
The devil is trying everything he can to confuse us.

Let us all stay in the word and pray without ceasing.
God be with us-He will show us the way.

We surely have to discern everything anymore.
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Doesn't someone have a user name Lady Nada? What does that mean then?
shy1
QUOTE(choirgirl @ Jan 9 2006, 03:21 PM)
QUOTE(RosielovesJesus @ Jan 9 2006, 05:09 PM)
This new age stuff is creeping in everywhere.
Oh Lord keep us in the right path.
The devil is trying everything he can to confuse us.

Let us all stay in the word and pray without ceasing.
God be with us-He will show us the way.

We surely have to discern everything anymore.
[right][snapback]32802[/snapback][/right]


Doesn't someone have a user name Lady Nada? What does that mean then?
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Hopefully just a coincidence--may not mean anything to do with new age. Could be a nickname, like our dear British friend who recently changed her name from a nickname to Tzeitel (sp?). I just recognized the word and looked it up and got freaked out by the whole thing--not anything to do with a user name.
everwatchful
Oooooookay. Firstly, I didn't mean to start a big debate between y'all, or inject any friction into the situation. I'm not used to such a turnout to an idea of mine, because for the most part, I'm relatively uneducated and have a hard time putting my mind into word-form. Usually, it all turns out as a jumbled mess of jotting ideas and random points that seem to have no place anywhere.

The references to the 'ascended masters' is an aknowledgment of the new age 'christ', which is being, currently and subversively, trickled into the doctrines of churches, from a judgemental, resolute, and jealous Lord, to a like everyone, accept everyhting, feel good lord. By simply reading the Word, we know this to be a lie, but all that asode, it's still turning up in the churches and doctrines of once anti-dogmatic, pro-scripture congregations. This cosmic happy time buddy christ is rapidly being accepted, and the true face of our Lord as the one and only way to the Kingdom is being slyly pushed aside in favor of happy time fake jesus. Not cool. I brought it up because it's been so celeverly snuck in, and interwoven with all of these ascended masters, that they look as though they are going to soon become a topic of churches. That's right, forsaking absolute salvation for a wellwishing accept everyone fest that makes Christ more of a mindset than a once mortal man, and risen Saviour of mankind. If I didn't think it was important to mention, I'm sure I would have saved the time typing and omitted it. I'm not trying to offer an alternative version of our faith, I'm trying to warn you against something which could soon arise and overtake everyone with nice feelings, now that the Muslims, Buddhists, Hindus, sun worshippers, and the pagan stick and tree worshippers are now getting along, and affirming each other's faiths. You'll notice a similar occurance inside of the Catholic Chruch that parallels Islam, which stated that the Jews are correct in awaiting their Messiah, along with Islam that states the Imam Mahdi is going to come with 'Isa', whom they claim is Jesus (And I named as Maitreya) which will go around telling the world He wasn't crucified, and is a liar, and submit himself underneath the Imam in prayer. Then they'll destroy Christianity. hat's not my story, or our story, that's Islam's story, and seeing as the Roman church agrees, I see it as a simple, outward, and maybe less than nice feeling connection that one should not ignore unless they'd rather be comfy than logical in this whole mess. Once again I state: I oppose the Roman church, but still see Roman Catholics as my brothers and sisters, because while they don't worship Jesus te same way i do, they still think they worship Him, so when the time comes, I'm pretty sure a great many will make the right decision. Like we're taught, "Hate the sin, love the sinner".

As for my statements regarding my point of view, theories, and ideas. I hardly think I am a worthy vessel for God to speak through, and would never in my wildest dreams posses the raw and immitigated arrogance needed to claim I was divine. I have been tempted by the evil one, even through my very name, who's translation is:
Ian - Iohn, John, God's mercy.
Kouf - French variation of the 19 letter in the Hebrew Aleph Beth, meaning monkey, back of the head, holiness, immeasurable light. In greek, hollow. In german, to trade. In arabic, liar.

I could stand here and say I am St. John the Divine, and have been tempted to do so by the serpent just by having my name, but I know it's not true, because I posess neither the saintliness nor the wisdom. I am simply not good enough a person to be such a great, enlightened, inspired individual. So, I chalk it up to having a parent ignorant of my surnames meaning, who wanted me to be named Ian because they simply saw me as the lioght in their life when it was at one of it's roughest points. I doubt I'm even smart enough to have the arrogance to claim inspiration. No, God doesn't talk to me, and I don't have visions or prophesies. I am a normal man of average-ish intellect, with a good mom, and a love for God. And ya know what, even if He doesn't talk to me, I'll still walk my own self to the chopping block, and stick my own neck on the log for my execution in His name. With pride, a coke and a smile.

Now, as for the 14 years being too hard on God's chosen. I hadn't written it as a full fledged tribulation. I look at the first five seals as signs to the world that He is comming back, with the sixth being the sealing of those who are still faithful after watching the work of the four horsemen, and still loving God even though many people are dying all around, and times are exponentially more terifying than they have been in millenia. Durring the sixth, I estimate (Yeah, because I'm NOT A PROPHET), that the pole shift that happens, being already foretold by scientists is going to pretty much reinforce the scientist's theories on accidental life and evolution, cosmic chaos, etc, etc. Essentially, giving those who see God as an invisible guy who only little kids and stupid adult believe in, louder, more pronounced voices, possibly publicly denouncing God. You'll notice that at the end, two very important things happen:

God has His chosen sealed, and if this is the same sealing as Ezekiel 9, all of the invaders in Jerusalem are obliterated overnight. This does two things, first propping up those who have been called crazy for the last 3.4 years, and second, adding a pre-fear to those who deny God, and incur His wrath with their ignorance and self-righteouness. I say pre-fear, because they have no clue what fear is yet. This is but a taste of the anger God has stored up for them. Next, the horsemen stop, and the stars fall. This si also a time of confoundment because the guy all of the churches have labeled the antichrist stops what he's doing, and ceases to be a threat. From here until the last trumpet, I ASSUME (Know for sure with the fifth, sixth, and seventh trumpets) that until the last trumpet, the sealed are unscathed, and witness miracles, and I mean real miracles which are unexplainable. Possibly this causes a mistrust of Christians, and warms up the ovens so to speak for when God taken His protection away from His chosen sealed. After this, I theorized that the antichrist rises to 'banish' the dragon after he is expelled permanently before the yes of man, to 'hell' or someplace hidden so that he can look like the messiah. I say this because it comes after the seventh trumpet in the Book, and really, who am I to attatch a guessed timeline to the whole thing? To put a gap her, or an overlap there. Who am I really to say something so egotistical as that? I go by what it says, hence the term Revelation. Now, this, after the seventh trumpet and at the rise of the antichrist is where I theorize the beast system signs the treaty with all, treating everyone as though they are right, and placing himself in the middle of it all as some sort of divine moderator. Like a sheep, he pretends to be about everyone's good. 1260 days after the last trumpet, I said he proclaims himself the god of earth, and 30 days later, he places himself on God's seat. That's when the treaty ends with the Christians, and the routine executions, forced reception of the mark, and building of the image occur. That's what I said in my theory. In all, I theorized a time period of 45 to 75 days of tribulation for the sealed on earth, until day 1335, when Christ takes us into His arms, and begins the vialworks on the beasts kingdom.

That is what I said. I never said there is 14 years of tribulatiopn, because really, up until the end of the sixth seal, it's a universal tribulation, with a possible pass for the sealed through the trumpets, but definetly from five, six, and seven. After that, we can assume this treaty includes us to get as many of us as possible. Since those who are sealed, and those who have been saved since the sealing by those who prophecy in His name, heal the sick, or are touched and taught by the two witnesses will refuse the beast as 'god', we'll be killed after he finds no more use for us, and knows we won't cave to his lies.

I hope I offered some insight into what I was saying. In a nutshell:

seals 1-6 - Universal hardships, war, famine, death, falling stars, probable pole shift, sealing of the saved.

seal 7 - rest period

trumpets 1-7 - tribulation for the heathens, possibly for the sealed and faithful as well, although the fifth, sixth, and seventh are promised to us as painless and will not effect us.

3.5 years post trumps - antichrist's treaty with many, one world reigion, and political system. Beast system in place. Temple is rebuilt. Satan flirts with the flock.

1260 days after the last trump - antichrist calls himself god. Time for Christians to die. Miracles? I hope so.

1290 days after - abomintion of desolation, antichrist steals God's seat, demands worship of image, and aknowledgement as god. Not a cool time. Only way up now is martyrdom for the unsaved by refusing mark, and resisting beast, and aknowledging Jesus Christ as our one and only Lord and Saviour.

1335 days after the last trump - the great snatching up.

1336 - 2520 - vials, boils, cancers, heat, darkness, gnashing of teeth, armeggedon, one hundred and thirty pound hailstones for the beast.

After that, it's the Kingdom on Earth, absense of evil, and perfection for mankind. Yay, happytime.

That's all I was sayin.

Your brother in Christ, and hopefully your golfin' buddy in the Kingdom(Cuz you all know that if Jesus plays sports, He's gotta love golf.) ,
Ian

I forgot to mention that while I haven't been touched or given visions, I have been saved three times by God's messengers as a child. Once while nearly drowning at 3 years old in a lake fromt he end of a dock("Don't breathe in" and I spent some time staring at the wavy trees through the water.), and twice when almost hit by a car in a parking lot and semi truck at an intersection, where the same guy actually put his hand in them, and they stopped dead where they were. Old guy with friendly eyes.
RosielovesJesus
everwatchful-you don't have to have visions to belong to God.
You are God's child and you are being watchful, I can understand that.
God has protected you. Praise the Lord you are okay.

God bless
everwatchful
Thank you so much for your kind words, Rosie. God bless you too. smile.gif
benny balerio
QUOTE(everwatchful @ Jan 5 2006, 04:03 AM)
Ok, I know, I know...

"The antichrist signs a treaty, and establishes a coventant with all for seven years! That's the seventieth week of Daniel!!!"

I understand, but please, be openminded, and try not to freak out. What I propose is a seven year period before the antichrist, in which the seals are opened, and the trumpets are blown. I've read nowhere that says that the white horseman is the antichrist, and if you have, please, tell me where so I can correct myself. I also understand that some of my terminology may confuse some people, and if this is the case, ask me to clarify before you chain me to the telephone pole and stone me to death. I've posted this on other forums and was met with reactions ranging from passive aggressive sniping, to understanding, and from all out mockery (which I never take too well, although I'll try to be graceful if encountered with it here.) to being called names. I like questions, but if you want to be a meanie about it, please try and remember, I'm not trying to confuse, or write my own doctrine. I'm a Bible Christian, and I believe that as my brothers and sisters, you can all act Christian about any questions or problems you have with my timeline. I haven't done any overlapping, and there's no gap insterted anywhere, it's non-Preterist, and non-Dispenionalist. The spans of time are based on seal number seven (silence for a half and hour), and trumpet number five (they hurt men for five months), and all seals and trumpets are broken down into six month segments because of this.

My motivation for this timeline stemmed from a question I posed to myself:
Given what we know wbout the Bible, and Biblical prophecy, what could possibly hapen that would deceive the very elect? As I pondered, I came to the conclusion that if seven years passed, and all of these things that could be called seals and trumps happened, who would everyone on Earth expect next? This is the only way the antichrist could be accepted, as anyone who stands up during the seals and trumps would be instantly called antichrist (because it is commonly thought antichrist will come durring the seals and trumps), and if he died at the hands of someone, who would the world think HE was? If seven years of seals and trumpets passed, and a man stood up to unite the world, how many churches would proclaim him 'Christ'? I feel that this is the only possible way the elect could be deceived, due to the depth of the knowledge in Bible prophecy in the Christian community these days, and the lack of outside non-Biblical doctrine in most congregations. We as His flock, need to be wise as serpents, and this wisdom needs to be available to all, meaning one shouldn't have to know other languages to understand the Bible, nor the prophecy in it. Children should understand it, and assigning crazy, jump-around, overlapping timelines to the last days of the current age of man is counter-layterm. If Revelation were written as a riddle, it would hardly be a Revelation, now would it?

Now, without any further delay, I give you my timeline, based on a linear interpretation of Revelation, citing primarially Revelation. I know, there are other prophetic books in the Bible. But Revelation is the only one labeled 'The Revelation of Jesus Christ', and in the New Testament. I'm not degrading the value of the others, but I feel that the book of Revelation is a one stop shop for all we're going to encounter in those last days, and is inclusive of all prophecy in all other books regarding the last days. Once again, if I'm wrong, give me the scripture to support my incorrect view, and I'll accept it gracefully. Also, I understand a vast majority of the events start in Jerusalem (ie- Ezekiel 9), but as a Christian, I'm going from a worldview, as opposed to a Jerusalem centric point of view, since there are Christians everywhere on Earth.

Here it is:

Unofficial Theoretical Timeline
Rev 6:1,2
1st Seal - day 0 - 180: White Horseman goes out to conquer. King type, possibly the EU, or an EU affiliated nation. Of note are the bow and crown. The bow, being a ranged weapon, not meant for close contact warfare suggests missiles, or even a Bay of Pigs type of conquest, in which a developed country uses thier nuclear arsenal to intimidate other nations into submission. Another possibility is a Parthian Bow concept, which means a shot or blow which one cannot recover from. A possibility is the 30', 14 ton Tungsten rods floating around the earth designed as inertia weapons. These would, in essence, cause a multimile wide crater in the earth, along with a shock wave that could be felt around the world up to 3 times.  The crown suggests a king, president, or other supreme dignitary which controls this action. You'll notice, the rider of this white horse doesn't have a crown, but is given a crown, possibly meaning he is appointed and then starts his conquest at the beginning of his reign. This man will obviously be mistaken for the antichrist, as that is oftentimes who he is labeled as. This is one of the first deceptions, having existed far prior to this horseman's ride, and started by God knows who. Common sense tells you otherwise, as the mathematic harmony of the Book of Revelation suggests it is a point for point, in order timeline of events to occur. The mathematic structure of Revelation can be discussed with a man named Vernon Jenkins, MSc, who has done extensive research on the mathematic structure of the Bible, finding that the first five (Torah), and the last (Revelation) books of the Bible display a statistically impossible harmony to imbed without one actually being inspired and guided by God Himself during the writing process. (That's right. Proof of the Bible.)
Rev 6:3,4
2nd Seal - day 181 - 360: Red Horseman goes to make war. Good chance this red horseman is the reunified USSR, along with it's new allies China, Iran, Sudan, Libya, and maybe Cuba. This is likely the Army of Gog, and WW3 follows. China and Russia seem givens, as one is a poor ex-red state that secretly despises the West, and also happens to make weapons, the other a current red state that openly, yet passivly (economically) hates the West, has butt loads of money and wants to buy weapons. This will probably be easily noted by thier attack on Israel, and outwardly labeled the second seal by the big Biblical 'scholars' on tv, and in the churches around the world. Further, the color Red not only denotes war, bloodshed and violence, but possibly the political banner they (Russia and China) unite under.
Rev 6:5,6
3rd Seal - day 361 - 540: Black Horseman rides to spread famine. This famine could be caused intentionally by the red horseman and a possible nuclear attack, or by simply invading it's enemy countries and poisoning food supplies. The militias in Africa which use hunger and food control to gain leverage in thier regions are great examples of what a lack of food can do to a nation/s.
Rev 6:7,8
4th Seal - 541 - 720: Pale Horseman rolls out, and along comes the zombies, which is probably where a lot of people start to lose faith, since there is no mention of zombies in the Bible, and everyone insists the dead in Christ rise first. The zombies are a foreign idea to Biblical prophecy, as they are never considered an optio, but the greek translation of Revelation 6:8 doesn't include the word 'Hell', but rather, the word 'Hades', which is literally the land of the dead, the dead themselves, or the god of the dead. Either way, if Hades follows, you either have the physical manifestation of dead people over the foruth part fo the world, or massive posessions causing those who are infected (possibly a disease, oddly enough, see Land of the Dead, and a host of other zombie movies. lol), posessed, or otherwise effected to slaughter people in "The fourth part of the earth". The phrasing of this could mean either a certain part of the earth, as in the fourth part, or a literal quarter of the Earth, meaning the death of 1.5 billion people.
Rev 6:9-11
5th Seal - 721 - 900: Saints and Martyrs call out for justice, and from the way the scripture is written, it seems as though they have no clue what's going on, as most of that which has happened in the last 2 years has been all but unconceivable. But, those which are sealed are not yet 'home', so nothing changes, and nothing stops. God has a very concise list of people that are to be martyred and sent to the Kingdom, and until every single last soul on that list is received, bad times continue.
Rev 6:12-17, 7:1-17
6th Seal - 901 - 1080: Probable pole shift, noted by the new slant in the earth, causing a massive shift in the jet stream, causing gigantic storms, and earthquakes. The sun may turn black due to the authors perspective, or as a result of a massive ash cloud triggered by the possible volcanic activity caused by the earthquake, and volcanos along the pacific rim due to the probable pole shift. Continents may dislodge. Moon may turn red due to an ash cloud, or some change in Earth's upper atmosphere due to the massive climate change. "Stars falling" may suggest hot ash pellets raining on the surrounding areas. Re: Mt. Vesuvius. The wind no longer blows, and the horsemen stop thier ride, either from injury or because God had just scared thier masses into shock. God sends his messengers to seal the chosen people at night, see Ezekiel 9, which tells of the beginning of this undertaking in Jerusalem. At this point, the invaders from Iran, Sudan, Libya, and the rest of the Muslim world are slaughtered overnight, confounding the world, and further accentuating God's, and backing up the prophecy scholars and students.
Rev 8:1-5
7th Seal - 1081 - 1260: Everything stops. But wait! The fun hasn't even started yet!!! At this time, most should be utterly confused on Earth, and have no clue what's going on, having abandoned the prospect of Biblical prophecy after the zombies and premature stoppage of  the one everyone thinks is the antichrist. Now is a time of profound confoundment, and shaky knees. There should be either a worldwide meteor shower, or even worse, 'aliens'. I know it sounds weird, but who else would the little guys in the disks be but the Nephilim?
-Trumpets-
Note: There are thunderings, voices, and lightenings, and finally, another earthquake. Probable date unk.
Rev 8:6,7
1st Trumpet - 1261 - 1440: Hmmm...hail and fire mingled with blood, and spread about the earth. Sounds like a supervolcano erupting. A third of the trees and all green grass are burnt. Yellowstone Caldera? Also, probable date of the Two Witnesses starting their ministry (Rev 11:1-13). The outer temple is given to the gentiles for 42 months, aka, 3.5 years during their ministry as a sanctuary, or possibly taken by seige by the enemy of God. Keep in mind, that neither the first nor the second beast kills the witnesses, but rather, the dragon from the pit. This is important, as it plays directly into the "dragon is antichrist", "beast is dragon" mindset the Roman church has shovel-fed the masses. This simply isn't so, and there is no scripture to support this doctrine.
Rev 8:8,9
2nd Trumpet - 1441 - 1620: Great, now a meteor hits a major body of water (No, not like a lake, like an OCEAN.), and kills a third of the fish, and sinks a third of the ships. This is obviously a meteor because, well, what else could a big chunk of rock slamming into the sea be? It ain't a teddy bear or a tricycle, I'll tell ya that. smile.gif
Rev 8:10,11
3rd Trumpet - 1621 - 1800: A comet, aptly named 'Wormwood' (Chernobyl in Russian), hits the source of a major water supply, a third of the rivers and streams are radiated, and a lot of people die from radiation poisoning. The difference between the two, the meteor and the comet, is composition. Meteors are comprised of rocks, metals, debris, and other hard materials, while comets are comprised mainly of frozen gasses, liquids, and other soft materials. The appearance of the meteor of the second trump being of fire, and the comet of the third trump being as a star, or lamp falls entirely on thier composition, and how either would react upon entering Earth's atmosphere. The windless environment of Earth after the sixth seal allows the radioactive (possibly) contamination of the comet Wormwood to stay in one confined area, and spread only through the water supply instead of creating worldwide fallout as it would in our current environmental status.
Rev 8:12,13
4th Trumpet - 1801 - 1980: Likely due to all of the debris (meteoric and comet blowback, supervolcanic ash) floating around in our windless upper atmosphere, the days are now 2/3 shorter than they were, and food is probably growing scarce. This may trigger a 'food is currency' system, and Ramen Noodles might be this year's gold. The darkness can be explained by the thickness of said debris in relation to the sun's angle to the sun. The debris floating about would seem thicker at the horizons due to the Earth's spherical shape, and the light would only be able to make it through when at a higher point from our perspective.  Woe to the earth, because now, the gloves come off. The three woes follow.
Rev 9:1-12
FIRST WOE
5th Trumpet - 1981 - 2160: A star falls and opens 'the pit', releasing locust horses that hurt the non-sealed for 5 months. My theory: "Aliens" (At least that's what they'll be called, confirming Saganism), aka, the fallen angels of the rebellion in Heaven, return overtly, and 'put a whoopin on a vast majority of the people remaining on earth, except those whom God had sealed before the seventh seal. They just seem too strange sounding to be helicopters or mutant manmade clone dinosaurs or something. They are ruled by Abaddon, who is the angel of the bottomless pit, and appropriately, the hunter of mankind and destroyer of things good, righteous, cuddly, or otherwise genuinely pure and innocent. These five months will most likely convince the world that the sealed are in cahoots with the destroyer, as he can't hurt them. Perhaps the Persecution gets a kick start, and Christians become targets again for exclusion, suspicion, or even attempted genocide. I say attempted because at this point, and throughout the three woes, those sealed by God are protected for the first three warm up beatings the heathens are to receive. Basically, we just get to watch.
Rev 9:13-21, 10:1-7
SECOND WOE
6th Trumpet - 2161 - 2340: Four angels ruling over a combination of 200,000,000 troops go out to slay a third of the non-sealed men. The beasts ridden by these horsemen are like dragons with snakeheads on thier tails, that breathe fire, smoke and brimstone. Not only does a third of the remaining sinful men die, but more importanly, none of the sealed meet this fate, probably escalating the attempted violence against the sealed faithful remnant. By now, the remaining 2/3 of the sinful men are probably ENFURIATED at the sealed folks, and not only have disbelief in God, but a hatred for His followers. Also, an angel stands with his feet in both the sea and the land, and declares by He who lives forever and ever that there is "TIME NO MORE". I'm not sure if this means the Earth stops turning, or if it means that those who are lost now, are lost forever without Christ.
Rev: 10:3,4
SEVEN THUNDERS do thier thundering.
Rev: 11:15-19
THIRD WOE
7th Trumpet - 2341 - 2520: The seventh angel sounds, and Heaven becomes fricking VISIBLE, along with His ark and a bunch of lightening. It may not seem all that scary to those who are faithful, but to those who dedicated the last six and a half years to worshiping trees and little rocks and demons and stuff, this is terrifying. Also, the Witnesses die at the hand of the big red dragon. There is lightning, and voices, and thunderings, and an earthquake, and great hail. Uh oh, the Witnesses woke up too (day 2523?), and ascended to Heaven, which really shocks all the newly God fearing people who now have PROOF, and a nice warm puddle of pee pee to stand in. They are now prepped to receive the false Christ.

Now, there is the swing time, when the world has just found out, unrefutably, that there is most certainly a God, and that all of the things that have happened have happened for as reason. Unfortunately, most people believe in a 7 year total trib and return concept, which was constructed by the very church that is to seize power during this time...the last standing physical church on earth, which still sits in ROME. I mean, who better to give the world advice than the 'Replacement of Jesus' (vicarius filii dei, the Popes literal title), since we just found out there is most certainly a God and all. This is all fine and dandy, because there is about to be a great sign in the heavens, and the antichrist is to come forward to start his overwhelming humanitarian work, and eventually proclaim himself the messiah at the head of both the Roman Catholic Church (The sun the woman is clothed in), and the Islamic faith (The moon at her feet.), and the twelve stars being the 'ascended masters of the twelve major world faiths which are to be combined into the final one world religion which are to be headed by the man child of the woman (church), which is the finalized apostate church. Don't get too excited, because now the giant red dragon is going to receive the rest of his  whoopin that started some 14 thousand or so years ago from Michael, and the rest of God's angels. Oh yeah, and we all get to watch. At this time, God has softened everyone up, and everyone has either made up thier mind as to who they are behind, and who they support. There is purpose in the sealing of God's people wayyyyy back at the sixth seal, because they all still live on earth, and are henceforth exiled from the fake faith they refuse, along with the fake mark of the beast, which is the king of the New Roman Empire: The Crown Prince Merovignian of England!
(This is only MY guess, and rests entirely on his birthdate, name, previous humanitarian work, geographical location, religious claims, and bloodline)
WILLIAM V | VVIIIIAM V | I AM VIVIVI

Yeah, he'll be the right age (Same age as Jesus when He started His ministry) at this time, too. It should be either on his 30th birthday, or 180 days past, which is the beginning of the Mayan's and Egyptian's so called Golden Age: Day 2520, and end of the final trumpet. He'll be declaring himself  'Hamashiach' on day 3780 on his actual 33rd birthday, a scant 75 days from the vanishing on day 3855, at night. This is the date of the 'rapture' of the church, and the real cause for confusion, since it was supposed to happen some 7 years ago. From here, the final seven bowls of God's pissed-offed-ness gets dumped on the apostate church. Note, after the rapture, the only way to God is through martyrdom, and refusal of the mark of the beast. This beginning of the "Golden Age" is that which will confuse the very elect, as everyone insists that there is a seven year "from start to Jesus" tribulation. As soon as these seven years are up, and all of these amazing things have happened, along with the permanent banishment of the dragon from Heaven (Which will result in his desperation moves to follow, figuring if he can't be God, he'll damn all of God's people. The sealed know better.), all on Earth are going to assume that the next to stand up and claim to be Messiah will be He Himself, or Jesus Christ that is. It is this that will suck mankind into receiving the mark of the beast in thier forehead, which is the belief that this imposter is the Christ (faith), and in thier right hand, as they actively worship this phony (works). The sealed, knowing better, especially after the death and ressurection of the witnesses, will refuse and either be hunted down and killed for refusing to aknowledge him as Christ, or will live the next 75 days in absolute terror, not able to find shelter anywhere, or food and other staples.

The Bowls for Mr. Beasty Pants:

Bowl 1 - Boils...ya do't get much more straight forward here. Deep abcesses in the skin and maybe even internal organs. Excruciating pain and death from sepsis are likely companions. Pain is a certainty, which is known by anyone who's ever had a good sized boil. Yeah, now imagine that ALL OVER YOUR BODY. Painful? Psh, to say the least.

Bowl 2 - All water in the sea turns to blood, all fish die, and O2 is no longer as available as it was prior to, since a vast amount of oxygen is produced by ocean bound algae. The drop in oxygen triggers either a rapid dequantavolution in the health of men, animals, and plants, or forces everyone indoors to actually breathe properly.

Bowl 3- All potable water turns to blood. Yuck. I'm sure the smell's not all that great either once the sun starts to warm it up. Give it a week, and the WHOLE world will smell like a pool of blood on a hot day.

Bowl 4 - Ozone layer disappears, and horrific sunburns along with malignant malenomas help to hide the hideous boils. It probably hurts to breathe, move, or even think about now.

Bowl 5 - Babylon falls in a day, and darkness covers the beast's kingdom. Babylon is the capitol of the beast's kingdom, and likely the center for his operations. Like the Washington DC of the world. Lots of crying and gnashing of teeth follow, as this is unthinkable by those left on earth.

Bowl 6 - The beast pulls together his troops to make war against God at Harmeggido. The dragon, who has been very quiet since the end of the fight, along with the false prophet Mr. Imam Mahdi, and the antichrist dispatch three unclean spirits to call together the armies of the world to stand behind the beast.

Bowl 7 - Not only do they lose, but they get to deal with hundred pound hailstones too. Splat, beeatch.

Day 5040, the fate of everything is sealed, and the new kingdom is established. Any and all evil is exterminated, and no longer exists. The sealed, saints, martyrs, babies, and hopefully my golf clubs get to live with Jesus forever and ever in the New Jerusalem for a thousand years, or rather, a long, unending period of time, without need for food, or anything outside of faith alone and God's love.


Notes:

The First beast is the theopolitical system that is the new rome. It is headed by one, but given the form of a democracy, which is the purpose of the ten heads. After a small uprising, the antichrist absorbs three of the ten kingdoms, and becomes the 'little horn', placing his temporary throne in Brussels, until the new Rome is moved to Jerusalem on Day 3780. Amnongst those who will realize what's going on are people form all faiths who convert, and those apart of bastard Christianities like Mormonism, JW's, Catholics, Protestants, Dispensionalists, etc. that have no real basis in scriptural Christianity, and rely almost entirely on doctrine written by men.

The Second beast is the false prophet/s, which has two horns like a lamb. This not only means that they have the sound and appearance of peaceful and kind men, but that there are actually known most commonly as Imam Mahdi, and Maitreya, who are to go out and claim that Jesus (Played by Maitreya) was never crucified, and isn't the savior, and the 'real' savior is being brought in by this Imam Mahdi fellow. Essentially, Imam is pretending to be John the Baptist, and laying a path for little Willy boy as the 'real' Hamashiach. This Fake John will go about with Fake Jesus and apologize fraudulently for the 'misunderstanding'. These two will be called ascended masters, and will herald the comming of the one they will call the twelfth master, the messiah, lord and savior of the world. These acsended masters comprise the twelve stars surrounding the church's head, along with El Morya, Djwahl Khul, Hilarion, Mary, Nada, Serpis Bey, Racoksky, St. Germain, Paul the Venetian, and Khutumi, all of which are likely fallen angels of high rank underneath the fallen lucifer.

This image of the beast, which is given life, is actually a statue built to pass judgement on those unsealed few remaining before the rapture, which I will politely refer to as the 'fence sitting lucky folks who get to die martyrs' who are awarded with decapitation, or some other form of public execution. These are the only non-sealed (At the sixth seal) to enter into heaven, and they enter as martyrs either resisting, refusing, or defending others like themselves from the beast system. Beware, the two of the second beast will seem genuine and will do amazing things. Make no mistake, they are as dragons.

Magic exists, astrology works, and demons can be summoned. None-the-less, we are told not to practice any of them. So, wether they exist or not, do even think about it. It's not an option, and will cause you more trouble than it will save you from. Think: "LONG RUN". Eternity is a really long time.

-Ian Kouf
2:42am 20051213

PS - Rome says the Jews are correct in awaiting the Messiah. Keep that in Mind.

And that's my theoretical, hypothetical, rehtorical timeline which I wrote all by myself, based on 2 and a half years of constant obsession and compulsion to understand everything there is to understand on the subject of the enditmes and the mystery religion of the beast's kingdom. The faith is already pretty much built and only needs to be fleshed in by these events to gain validity amongst those to be decieved in the end time. The freemasons are to built the temple and have been holding these secrets, although a good 99.95% of them have no idea currently of that which they are apart of, since a key masonic doctrine is to lie to the initiate until it's determined that they can participate in the 33° Scottish Rite sharing of this secret. Thier key beliefs stem from Rosicrusianism, Theosophy (Helen Blavatsky, Alice Bailey, the foundation of the Ascended Masters theology), Kabbalah, and Apolloism, also commonly known as sun worship, Gematria, and other mystery faiths. The worship of light is most easily noted by light's properties, namely, the ability to be a constant straight line, and bend but never break, reflect but never move from a fixed point without outside stimuli. Basically, it's the measurement, and the masonic anchor for thier faith in Lucifer.

(Written listening to winamp channel: Bebop 24x7...get on it for the best jazz around.)

That concludes my theoretical, common-sensical interpretation of Revelation from a lay term standpoint. Please, take time to flip through your Bible and compare the points noted. I feel pretty strongly that this is a more realisitic version, not based on science, but oddly enough, based on my gut instinct, and drive to write it. I spent three months working on it, and started after more than 2 years of research on the NWO, mystery religions, and other factors supports in the antichrist and beast system. I don't want to point fingers at any gorup of people, but rather doctrines and chruches, because while I don't think Catholics worship the devil on purpose, I do think they worship Apollo everytime they go to mass, even though they think they're worshipping Jesus Christ. I try to look at it from Jesus' point of view; hate the sin, love the sinner. Afterall, noones perfect, and even the most hardcore atheist is going to be converted in His light, and even the most devout Muslim will drop his koran and follow in His glory when He returns, so please, don't take it as passing judgement, take it as what I consider forewarning, to save some people the confusion they might face. I hope you enjoyed the timeline, and found it at least interesting. In summary - Seals - 3.5 years, Trumpets - 3.5 years, antichrist setting up kingdom - 3.5 years, antichrist setting himself up as god and getting a serious sapnking from the real God, 3.5 years.

Thank you for your time, and God bless you. smile.gif
wub.gif Your brother in Christ,
everwatchful
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Dear Everwatchful,.......I will try to answer the question as to who the rider is on the white horse.......I personally believe the rider is the antichrist.....If you will notice....a crown was given to him......but then again...in revelation 19;12 you will notice that the Lord has many crowns.......I do know that the antichrist will come in peacefully,and will destroy many. The color of the horse,being white ....to my understanding, represents peace..................benny
calvin
Benny,

I do not believe this myself, but one theory is that the first white horse represents the conquering of Christianity with the gospel going forth.

I believe that the rider on the first white horse ... with crown and bow, represents the Anti-Christ ... white being the deceptive colour of peace.

I wonder what colour the "popemobile" is ... it wouldn't just happen to be white would it ?

When John of Patmos was given a vision of this event, I wonder how he would describe such a vehicle ?
justaservant