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benny balerio
We Cannot be under Law and under Grace


Among Christians in various parts of the world an extremely dangerous spiritual movement is under way, where people in many respects revert back to the Old Testament law. They do so under the deceptive supposition that the outward observance of the law would add to the grace of Christ to make them better Christians. The converse situation, however, is more likely to be true, as this practice may jeopardise people’s salvation.

An objective study of the law in the New Testament (NT) – not quoting selectively only those sections which support one’s own view – clearly indicates that, in the time after the crucifixion and resurrection of Jesus and the outpouring of the Holy Spirit, we are no longer under the law:

· “Sin shall not have dominion over you, for you are not under law but under grace” (Rom. 6:14). We are not convicted of sin by the law, but by the Holy Spirit who ministers the grace of Christ to us and instils His image in us. Everything which is in conflict with the nature of Christ is sin. The NT fully informs us about the works of the flesh (sin), as well as the fruits of the Spirit which represent God’s righteousness (cf. Gal. 5:16-22).

· “For Christ is the end of the law for righteousness to everyone who believes” (Rom. 10:4). Christ’s work of grace, as well as the example of His perfect life (1 John 2:6; 1 Pet. 2:21), calls and enables us to reach loftier heights in our spiritual life. The faithful following of the Lord Jesus leads to more complete sanctification than was possible through the law. That is why Paul said that his righteousness was not from the law but through faith in Jesus Christ (Phil. 3:9).

· “If righteousness comes through the law, then Christ died in vain” (Gal. 2:21). The law renders all people guilty before God (Rom. 3:19), since no person can comply with the demands of the law to be saved through it. The law only brings us knowledge of sin but cannot save us. We can only be saved by accepting Christ’s atoning death and then surrender ourselves to be guided into all truth by His Spirit.

· “You have become estranged from Christ, you who attempt to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace” (Gal. 5:4). Any Christian who tries to supplement the grace of the Lord Jesus by observing the law – even if it is only the legalistic observance of the Sabbath – actually says by this action that Christ is not sufficient for him, thereby undermining the gospel of the cross. We cannot be under law and under grace at the same time!

The reference to observance of the law in Matthew 5:17-19 was relevant to that particular time, since Jesus had not yet made atonement for our sins, and the Holy Spirit was not yet poured out to convict people of their sin. The law fulfils the function as a tutor to Christ as only He can save (Gal. 3:24). The relevance of the law as a tutor to Christ still prevails, but in the period after Christ it can only be applied to unsaved sinners: “… knowing this: that the law is not made for a righteous person, but for the lawless and insubordinate, for the ungodly and for sinners, for the unholy and profane” (1 Tim. 1:9).

In their Bible Knowledge Commentary (p. 732), Profs. Walvoord & Zuck comment as follows on this scripture: “The law is designed to show people their sinfulness. Thus the law is not for one who had already recognized his sin and turned to Christ. That person is no longer under the law but should now walk in the Spirit (Gal. 5:13-26). The law is intended for those who remain unconvinced of their sin.”

“But after faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor [the law]” (Gal. 3:25). The only law to which we are subjected is Christ’s New Testament law of love: “A new commandment I give to you, that you love one another; as I have loved you, that you also love one another” (John 13:34). If we love God and our neighbour we have fulfilled the entire law (Matt. 22:37-40; Rom. 13:8-10). That includes the command on the Sabbath as well, because in Christ we also enter the rest of the Lord. There is nothing wrong in observing a weekly day of rest (Sunday), thereby honouring and upholding a long-standing Christian tradition, but there are no laws pertaining to this day of rest in the Bible.

The love of God was poured out in our hearts by the Holy Spirit (Rom. 5:5) and enables us to live spiritually on a higher level than the law. There is not the slightest possibility that the liberty from dominion by the law, which we have in Christ (Gal. 5:1), can lead to a life of licentiousness. We have a clear command to holiness, and also a high calling of God in Christ Jesus. Reverting to the law will in no way help us to attain a higher level of sanctification.

Why do so many Christians return to the weak and insufficient elements of the law by observing days, months, seasons and years? (Gal. 4:9-10). These practices refer to weekly Sabbaths, new moons, sabbatical years and other Old Testament (OT) Jewish festivals. It is unthinkable that believers would try to gain additional merit before God by pursuing the shadows of the law after having received the final fulfilling of God’s work of grace through Jesus Christ in the NT. Is Christ, the Holy Spirit, and God’s love not sufficient to them? Do they want to supplement it, thereby detracting from grace? Let it be far from us to lapse into this heresy.

Hebrew roots or Christian roots?
The Hebrew Roots Movement is one of various movements committing themselves to exploring the roots of our faith in Israel’s language, culture and religious institutions. They use the image of the olive tree in Romans 11 as biblical justification for their movement. They see the olive tree as Israel, and the grafting in of the wild olive branches as the salvation of Gentiles, who then become part of a “spiritual Israel.” Having been grafted in, Christians from the Gentile world should then be spiritually edified and nourished by the sap which is offered to them from the trunk and roots of the olive tree (Israel).

In the process, many of these [Christian] believers develop a strong Jewish orientation by referring to themselves as spiritual Jews or Israelites, while also observing Jewish feasts and Sabbaths. They prefer to use Hebrew names and terminology – particularly the Hebrew names of God and Christ. Eventually they reduce themselves to no more than a Christian sect of Judaism, and try to live under the law and under grace.

Believers who think they have been grafted into Israel, actually imply that they were grafted into a nation who were dispersed during the past 2000 years because of rejecting the Messiah due to their unbelief and ignorance on Messianic prophecies in the OT. Now that this nation, still in unbelief, is restored to their land and again started keeping their feasts and Sabbaths in which Jesus is denied as Messiah, many Christians are participating with them!

The Hebrew Roots Movement is mistaken by their statement that the whole olive tree is a symbol of Israel. Actually, only the branches of the tree represent Israel – and they were broken off because of unbelief. We were not grafted into the severed branches of the tree, but into the trunk of the tree. The trunk and roots of the olive tree spiritually represent the Messiah. He is described as “the seed of Abraham”, who is the biological progenitor of Israel:

“And the Scripture, foreseeing that God would justify the nations by faith, preached the gospel to Abraham beforehand, saying, in you all the nations shall be blessed. So then those who are of faith are blessed with believing Abraham … Christ has redeemed us from the curse of the law, having become a curse for us … that the blessing of Abraham might come upon the Gentiles in Christ Jesus, that we might receive the promise of the Spirit through faith … Now to Abraham and his seed were the promises made. He does not say, ‘and to seeds,’ as of many, but as of one, ‘And to your seed,’ who is Christ” (Gal. 3:8-16).

The spiritual blessing which we obtain is not from the Jewish nation, but from the seed of Abraham, which is Christ. He is “the Root and the Offspring of David” (Rev. 22:16), in other words the origin and King of Israel who also came to be the Light and Salvation of the whole world (Acts 13:47). In John 15 similar symbolism is found of the stem and root which allude to Jesus, while the believers are the branches that are put in a position to bear fruit: “I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit” (John 15:5). The branches are pruned in order to bear more fruit. Ongoing sanctification and an unbroken relationship with the Lord Jesus should be pursued: “Abide in Me, and I in you” (John 15:4). We should, therefore, not become more Jewish, more inclined towards Old Testament institutions, and more legalistic - but more Christ-like, more oriented towards the New Testament, and more Spirit-filled.

The Old Testament is indeed important for spiritual edification and knowledge on God’s counsel for humanity. It also contains many prophecies on the first and second comings of the Messiah, including events that will follow the second coming of Christ, particularly the thousand-year reign of peace – when spiritually regenerated Israel will dwell in their land during the revealed kingdom of the Messiah, to be a blessing to the whole world. The NT is the fulfilment of OT promises; it is the substance of OT shadows (Col. 2:16-17). It would be foolish to revert to the shadows of the law and the prophets after having obtained the glorious fulfilment of these prophetic promises in the Lord Jesus, and having been empowered by the outpouring of the Holy Spirit. We have not been commissioned to become like Israel, but to lead spiritually blinded Jews to Jesus! Make use of OT prophecies to convince Jews that Jesus of Nazareth is indeed the Messiah and Saviour of the world.

Hebrew names
An inherent part of the Judaising of Christianity is the use of Hebrew names for God and the Lord Jesus. This is known as the Sacred Name Movement although their ideas are based mainly upon ignorance and false suppositions. Some of them even go so far as to contend that Greek names for God – from which the sacred names in other languages are also derived – all refer to idols. It is, for instance, alleged that Jesus is derived from Je-Zeus, which means Son of Zeus (a well-known pagan god in Greek mythology). In order to clarify this controversy we need to investigate the use of different languages in biblical times.

During the Assyrian and subsequent Babylonian captivity of Israel, and also during the ensuing period, most Jews had lost their knowledge of Hebrew. They started using Aramaic and Greek as colloquial languages. Aramaic was the lingua franca in the entire Middle East, being used by many different peoples. It was a mixture of Syrian and Hebrew. The biblical name for Syria is “Aram”. During the time of Jesus, Aramaic was the common language in Israel. Jesus and His disciples spoke a Galilean dialect of Aramaic. Knowledge of Hebrew was confined to educated Jews, e.g. the rabbi’s and the scribes.

Jesus Christ was referred to in Aramaic as Eashoa Msheekha, in Hebrew as Yashua (or Yeshua) Ha Mashiach, and in Greek as Iesous Christos (Iesous being pronounced as Yesous). All books of the New Testament were originally given in Greek by inspiration of the Holy Spirit (cf. 2 Tim. 3:16; 2 Pet. 1:21), and in these books God is rendered Theos, Lord is described as Kurios, and Jesus Christ is referred to as Iesous Christos. To allege that these are the names of idols derived from a non-Jewish culture is heretical. The Greek names for God (Theos and Kurios) had already been established for more than two centuries by then and were also generally used in Israel. They were never controversial.

The nouns God or gods can, however, be used as generic terms to refer to idols, other gods or foreign gods, depending on the context in which they are used. The devil can, for instance, be described as the god (theos) of this age (2 Cor. 4:4). The same rule also applies to Hebrew, where Elohim may both refer to God and to idols or other gods. In Exodus 20:2-3 God says: “I am the Lord (Yahweh) your God (Elohim) … You shall have no other gods (elohim) before Me.” Both the Greek and Hebrew personal names and nouns were originally used by the Holy Spirit while inspiring the authors of the Bible, and it is wrong to allege that the Greek names are poor translations of the Hebrew names.

In the time of Jesus, Aramaic was the common language in Israel. The statement in Acts 21:40 that Paul addressed the people “in the Hebrew tongue” (KJV), should have been translated more accurately as “in the Hebrew dialect” – in this case Aramaic. The Amplified Bible and the Modern King James Version say: “… he spoke to them in the Hebrew dialect.” The rendering of the NIV is as follows: “… he said to them in Aramaic”. In their Bible Knowledge Commentary (p. 417), Profs. Walvoord & Zuck comment: “When Paul was granted permission to speak to the mob, he addressed them in Aramaic, the common language of Palestinian Jews, used throughout the Middle East at that time.” Many of those were also able to speak Greek.

Septuagint
The Septuagint is a Greek version of the Old Testament which was translated in the third century BC in Alexandria, Egypt, for use by Greek-speaking Jews. It was widely used by Hellenistic Jews who were spread throughout the Greek empire and who gradually stopped using their Hebrew language. This translation also gave many non-Jews insight into Israel’s history, culture and religious development. Septuaginta is the Latin word for 70 and refers to the 70 Jewish scholars who did the translation. For this reason it is sometimes abbreviated LXX. Other sources state that there were 72 translators – six from each of the 12 tribes of Israel.

Following this tradition, all the books of the New Testament were originally written in Greek. For this reason we often find expressions like: “… which is translated …” (see Matt. 1:23; Mark 5:41; 15:22; 15:34; John 1:38; 1:42; Acts 4:36; 9:36). Reference is made to certain Aramaic and Hebrew words which were translated into Greek. The authors mostly quoted from the Septuagint, and occasionally from the Hebrew or Aramaic. There is extensive evidence in the Gospels that quotations were made from the Septuagint, and not from the Hebrew text of the OT.

Hebrew text contains no vowels, and was vowelised very much later. That is one of the reasons why the so-called “Bible codes” cannot work. Aramaic words are also encountered in the NT, such as Pharisee and Abba. Authors quoted from the Greek Septuagint, as that was the medium of instruction during the writing of the NT.

General consensus among scholars of the original languages is that the authors of the NT mainly quoted from the Septuagint. The OT sections from which Romans 3:13-18 and Hebrews 1:6 quote, do not even appear in the Hebrew texts and are only found in the Septuagint. The following, among other comments by them on Heb.1:6, is said by Profs. Walvoord & Zuck (ibid. p. 782): “The reference is to the Second Advent when the kingly prerogatives of the Son will be recognized with open angelic worship (cf. Ps. 97:7 where the LXX rendering ‘angels’ correctly renders the text).”

In light of these facts it is not possible that the sacred names should only be used in Hebrew. In any case, nobody knows exactly how God’s Name should be pronounced in Hebrew. The Tetragram YHWH can, in vowelised form, be pronounced in many different ways, e.g. Yahweh, Yehowah and Yahuweh. Consensus also lacks on how the name of Jesus should be pronounced in Hebrew – Yeshua, Yahshua or Yahushua.

Conclusion
Theologically we are on safe ground when using the names God, Lord, and Jesus Christ, which were derived from the Greek words. The Hebraic rendering of names and religious terminology often leads to a theological orientation where aspects of the OT law and covenants with Israel are emphasised at the detriment of the all-sufficiency of Jesus Christ and His work of grace in the NT. Whenever the church or any group of believers see themselves as Israel, theological room for erroneous teachings of this nature is made.
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Joshleet
I find this quite interesting that this is posted in the Prophecy forum. However, I am glad it is. I do agree, that Christ died once for all. I also agree that we are still under His grace, and will be until He returns. We know many will turn to Christ in the final hours just prior to HIs return. He will confirm His covenant with many, for one week.
[/indent]There is However, What I see, a very big problem in Christiandom today.. Why in tarnation is the majority of Believers, eagerly waiting for the rebuilding of the temple? Is not this also a return to the Law, Is not this also, a total Rejection of what Christ done on the cross? Christians view the rebuilding of the Temple, as some form of celebrated event. But what is God's Heart attitude towards the re-starting of the sacrifices?
QUOTE
Amos 5:20 Shall not the Day of the Lord be darkness, and not light? Even very dark, and no brightness in it? I HATE, I DESPISE YOUR FEAST DAYS, ANS I WILL NOT SMELL IN YOUR SOLEMN ASSEMBLIES. THOUGH YE OFFER ME BURNT OFFERINGS AND YOUR MEAT OFFERINGS, I WILL NOT ACCEPT THEM;....
We as Christians need to change our thinking about the end times, and why things truly happen. While we have a tendancy of viewing end time events through a set of Eyes eagerly awaiting the Lord to "evacuate us" out of here, we need to view events through the eyes of the Lord, and discern from His perspective why things are happening. One of the reasons the Day of the Lord occurs, is because the temple will be rebuilt, and the sacrifices will be restarted. This will be a total abomination to God!! Why do you think He puts Hooks in the Jaws, of an invading army, and brings them down on His own land? [indent]
So I do agree with you, going back to live under the law, can be very dangerous to ones Health.. But physically, and spiritually!
Stephen
"Whenever the church or any group of believers see themselves as Israel, theological room for erroneous teachings of this nature is made."

>This practice and behavior has decimated professing christianity under the misleading of false teachers and is the reason for much of the off course theology of today. Replacement theology is the game of Satan's waging.
benny balerio
QUOTE (Joshleet @ Sep 20 2008, 10:00 PM) *
I find this quite interesting that this is posted in the Prophecy forum. However, I am glad it is. I do agree, that Christ died once for all. I also agree that we are still under His grace, and will be until He returns. We know many will turn to Christ in the final hours just prior to HIs return. He will confirm His covenant with many, for one week.
[/indent]There is However, What I see, a very big problem in Christiandom today.. Why in tarnation is the majority of Believers, eagerly waiting for the rebuilding of the temple? Is not this also a return to the Law, Is not this also, a total Rejection of what Christ done on the cross? Christians view the rebuilding of the Temple, as some form of celebrated event. But what is God's Heart attitude towards the re-starting of the sacrifices?
QUOTE
Amos 5:20 Shall not the Day of the Lord be darkness, and not light? Even very dark, and no brightness in it? I HATE, I DESPISE YOUR FEAST DAYS, ANS I WILL NOT SMELL IN YOUR SOLEMN ASSEMBLIES. THOUGH YE OFFER ME BURNT OFFERINGS AND YOUR MEAT OFFERINGS, I WILL NOT ACCEPT THEM;....
We as Christians need to change our thinking about the end times, and why things truly happen. While we have a tendancy of viewing end time events through a set of Eyes eagerly awaiting the Lord to "evacuate us" out of here, we need to view events through the eyes of the Lord, and discern from His perspective why things are happening. One of the reasons the Day of the Lord occurs, is because the temple will be rebuilt, and the sacrifices will be restarted. This will be a total abomination to God!! Why do you think He puts Hooks in the Jaws, of an invading army, and brings them down on His own land? [indent]
So I do agree with you, going back to live under the law, can be very dangerous to ones Health.. But physically, and spiritually!

Man,.....I hope I can get you to see thru all this.
The tribulation is meant for Israel. To complete the 490 year decree.
Today a great majority of national Israel do not recognize Jesus as the Messiah.
They ...today are still looking for Him to appear!.....Today they do not believe the prophecy of His coming has yet come to pass.
Jesus stated to Israel in that day......"You would not except Me,but another will come in his own name, him you will except!........The Lord Jesus was referring to the anti-christ.Joshleet,.....The Sanhedrin are now back in Israel as they were in the days of old. It has been reported that they believe that the messiah will appear to them this coming passover.(talk about timing and rosh hashanna is a few days away)
Soon the Israelis will believe in a messiah who is really the anti-christ.
This "REVEALING" of the anti-christ does not happen until the "Abomination Of Desolation"....It is at that point that national Israel recognizes the anti-christ as to whom he really is.
In other words,...the revealing that was foretold had came to pass.

If the bride were still on the earth at the time of the confirmation of a 7 year agreement by the ac and israel as foretold in Daniel 9;27.....the bride would know who the ac was imediately.Christian in our government sector and military would not cooperate with this guy at all, and this statement is not even scratching the surface on how the Bride would react to Daniel 9;27
We are a very big hinderance to the ac's plan.....that is only a small part of the reason why we must be removed from this earth!The devils believe that Jesus is LORD AND THEY TREMBLE!...GREATER IS HE THAT IS IN YOU THAN he THAT IS IN THE WORLD! THE GATES OF HELL SHALL NOT PREVAIL AGANST THE CHURCH!IF YOU HAVE THE FAITH OF A MUSTERED SEED, YOU CAN MOVE MOUNTAINS!....JESUS SAID,..BLESSED ARE THOSE WHO HAVE NOT SEEN AND BELIEVE!...If you,..as the Bride of Jesus Christ had just wittnessed with your own eyes a 7 year confirmation between the ac and Israel,....YOU WOULD BE UNSTOPABLE!!!YOU ARE BAD TO THE BONE IN JESUS! sATAN CANNOT TOUCH THAT, AND WANTS NO PART OF WHAT DAMAGE THAT WE CAN DO TO HIM! Jesus,...on the cross,said...It is FINISHED!!!....Believe me,.....Jesus is not the one confirming a 7 year covenant with Israel!Jesus will be in heaven getting ready to unlease the second seal!

........................................................benny cool.gif

Joshleet
Benny, PLease Let me paint a different Picture for you of what the Lord revealed to me. You can accept it, you can reject it. You can "put it on a shelf." and we will see who is correct in the end. I am not approaching this with the intention of proving anothers perception of prophecy wrong. I am approaching this to warn my Brothers and Sisters in Christ of the deceptive plans of our adversary.
[/indent]Lets for a moment, assume my view is correct. It is the Messiah that confirms HIS covenant with many in the final seven years. This is the whole purpose of the "time of Jacob's trouble" Matthew 24:14, verifies this, From the mouth of the Lord Himself. Now, if it is the Messiah, that confirms his covenant with many, and it Is Him who stopps the sacrifices, then there is NO NEED for any kind of Treaty of any sort to begin the final 7 year period. [indent]
I'm gonna cut through all the "nicities". SAtan is going to "spoon feed" the church a seven year Lie. He is going to give them everthing they are Looking for. I am not stating that it is prophetical fulfillment, but it is beccause of what the church today is holding as true. The false Messiah will rise to power, after the World accepts the Ezekiel 38 Battle as Armageddon. He will have an entire seven year period he will point to, and proclaim that all phophecy is fulfilled, "I am the returned Messiah" Will you know the difference, or will you accept Him as Jesus returned, because you saw a treaty signed Seven years prior?
benny balerio
QUOTE (Joshleet @ Sep 21 2008, 12:25 AM) *
Benny, PLease Let me paint a different Picture for you of what the Lord revealed to me. You can accept it, you can reject it. You can "put it on a shelf." and we will see who is correct in the end. I am not approaching this with the intention of proving anothers perception of prophecy wrong. I am approaching this to warn my Brothers and Sisters in Christ of the deceptive plans of our adversary.
[/indent]Lets for a moment, assume my view is correct. It is the Messiah that confirms HIS covenant with many in the final seven years. This is the whole purpose of the "time of Jacob's trouble" Matthew 24:14, verifies this, From the mouth of the Lord Himself. Now, if it is the Messiah, that confirms his covenant with many, and it Is Him who stopps the sacrifices, then there is NO NEED for any kind of Treaty of any sort to begin the final 7 year period. [indent]
I'm gonna cut through all the "nicities". SAtan is going to "spoon feed" the church a seven year Lie. He is going to give them everthing they are Looking for. I am not stating that it is prophetical fulfillment, but it is beccause of what the church today is holding as true. The false Messiah will rise to power, after the World accepts the Ezekiel 38 Battle as Armageddon. He will have an entire seven year period he will point to, and proclaim that all phophecy is fulfilled, "I am the returned Messiah" Will you know the difference, or will you accept Him as Jesus returned, because you saw a treaty signed Seven years prior?

Why would the world except ezekial 38 as armageddon?
It can be proven scripturally that these are two different events.

............................................benny cool.gif
Joshleet
QUOTE (benny balerio @ Sep 20 2008, 11:44 PM) *
QUOTE (Joshleet @ Sep 21 2008, 12:25 AM) *
Benny, PLease Let me paint a different Picture for you of what the Lord revealed to me. You can accept it, you can reject it. You can "put it on a shelf." and we will see who is correct in the end. I am not approaching this with the intention of proving anothers perception of prophecy wrong. I am approaching this to warn my Brothers and Sisters in Christ of the deceptive plans of our adversary.
[/indent]Lets for a moment, assume my view is correct. It is the Messiah that confirms HIS covenant with many in the final seven years. This is the whole purpose of the "time of Jacob's trouble" Matthew 24:14, verifies this, From the mouth of the Lord Himself. Now, if it is the Messiah, that confirms his covenant with many, and it Is Him who stopps the sacrifices, then there is NO NEED for any kind of Treaty of any sort to begin the final 7 year period.
I'm gonna cut through all the "nicities". SAtan is going to "spoon feed" the church a seven year Lie. He is going to give them everthing they are Looking for. I am not stating that it is prophetical fulfillment, but it is beccause of what the church today is holding as true. The false Messiah will rise to power, after the World accepts the Ezekiel 38 Battle as Armageddon. He will have an entire seven year period he will point to, and proclaim that all phophecy is fulfilled, "I am the returned Messiah" Will you know the difference, or will you accept Him as Jesus returned, because you saw a treaty signed Seven years prior?

Why would the world except ezekial 38 as armageddon?
It can be proven scripturally that these are two different events.

............................................benny cool.gif

ANd it can be proven scripturally, that it WILL be accepted as Armageddom. There are even many Popular teachers of today, that teach that this is the final battle. WE know it isn't the final Battle. However, there are certian events within the Ezekiel 38 war, that will occur, that will bring most to the conclusion that this is the final Battle. Think about this. The Lord intervines when the Mountains of Israel are attacked. In Eze. 38:20, we witness "all the men on the face of the earth Shaking at the presence of God." Is the Lord returning Here? No He isn't. He is However, somehow supernaturally revealing Hi8mself to the entire World, all at the same time.
What will this Look Like? A War climaxing in ISrael....One that has brought on Great Destruction.....The Lord Revealing Himself.....It is after this the False Messiah will reign for 42 monts. Compare Ezekiel, 38 and the 6th seal of Rev. They are the same event. Is the sixth seal the day of the Lord, or is it a group of people, only accepting something that appears to be the day of the Lord. Remember, it is only the Sixth seal. The Lord said he would bring a strong delusion on those that Love not the truth. Satan is going to jump on this, and utilize it. for his own desires!
There is going to be certian events PRIOR to the reign of the False messiah, that will appear to be events that are prophesied to occur Prior to the return and reign of the Real Messiah. It will be a "mirror image" of events, that will be accepted as Full prophetic fulfillment, but they will occur PRIOR to ANTICHRIST. PEOPLE WIL BE DRAWING CONCLUSIONS, BY WHAT THEY ARE SEEING, (LIKE THOSE IN THE SIXTH SEAL, WHO HIDE FROM GOD) Instead of discering events by what the Word of God said will Happen.[indent]Jesus gave us fair warning. "You will Here of Wars and rumors of wars, but the end is not yet." Jesus knew that there will be a series of events in the "birthpains" that will be viewed and accepted AS THE END, but it won't be. Thus the reason why Jesus stated, "the end is not yet"! This is the reason why Revelation seems to repeat itself. Events are not concurrent, but consecutive in Revelation. One who doesn't understand the duplication scenario outlined in Revelation, will draw the conclusion, that it describes the same event, only in greater detail.
benny balerio
QUOTE (Joshleet @ Sep 21 2008, 08:36 AM) *
QUOTE (benny balerio @ Sep 20 2008, 11:44 PM) *
QUOTE (Joshleet @ Sep 21 2008, 12:25 AM) *
Benny, PLease Let me paint a different Picture for you of what the Lord revealed to me. You can accept it, you can reject it. You can "put it on a shelf." and we will see who is correct in the end. I am not approaching this with the intention of proving anothers perception of prophecy wrong. I am approaching this to warn my Brothers and Sisters in Christ of the deceptive plans of our adversary.
[/indent]Lets for a moment, assume my view is correct. It is the Messiah that confirms HIS covenant with many in the final seven years. This is the whole purpose of the "time of Jacob's trouble" Matthew 24:14, verifies this, From the mouth of the Lord Himself. Now, if it is the Messiah, that confirms his covenant with many, and it Is Him who stopps the sacrifices, then there is NO NEED for any kind of Treaty of any sort to begin the final 7 year period.
I'm gonna cut through all the "nicities". SAtan is going to "spoon feed" the church a seven year Lie. He is going to give them everthing they are Looking for. I am not stating that it is prophetical fulfillment, but it is beccause of what the church today is holding as true. The false Messiah will rise to power, after the World accepts the Ezekiel 38 Battle as Armageddon. He will have an entire seven year period he will point to, and proclaim that all phophecy is fulfilled, "I am the returned Messiah" Will you know the difference, or will you accept Him as Jesus returned, because you saw a treaty signed Seven years prior?

Why would the world except ezekial 38 as armageddon?
It can be proven scripturally that these are two different events.

............................................benny cool.gif

ANd it can be proven scripturally, that it WILL be accepted as Armageddom. There are even many Popular teachers of today, that teach that this is the final battle. WE know it isn't the final Battle. However, there are certian events within the Ezekiel 38 war, that will occur, that will bring most to the conclusion that this is the final Battle. Think about this. The Lord intervines when the Mountains of Israel are attacked. In Eze. 38:20, we witness "all the men on the face of the earth Shaking at the presence of God." Is the Lord returning Here? No He isn't. He is However, somehow supernaturally revealing Hi8mself to the entire World, all at the same time.
What will this Look Like? A War climaxing in ISrael....One that has brought on Great Destruction.....The Lord Revealing Himself.....It is after this the False Messiah will reign for 42 monts. Compare Ezekiel, 38 and the 6th seal of Rev. They are the same event. Is the sixth seal the day of the Lord, or is it a group of people, only accepting something that appears to be the day of the Lord. Remember, it is only the Sixth seal. The Lord said he would bring a strong delusion on those that Love not the truth. Satan is going to jump on this, and utilize it. for his own desires!
There is going to be certian events PRIOR to the reign of the False messiah, that will appear to be events that are prophesied to occur Prior to the return and reign of the Real Messiah. It will be a "mirror image" of events, that will be accepted as Full prophetic fulfillment, but they will occur PRIOR to ANTICHRIST. PEOPLE WIL BE DRAWING CONCLUSIONS, BY WHAT THEY ARE SEEING, (LIKE THOSE IN THE SIXTH SEAL, WHO HIDE FROM GOD) Instead of discering events by what the Word of God said will Happen.[indent]Jesus gave us fair warning. "You will Here of Wars and rumors of wars, but the end is not yet." Jesus knew that there will be a series of events in the "birthpains" that will be viewed and accepted AS THE END, but it won't be. Thus the reason why Jesus stated, "the end is not yet"! This is the reason why Revelation seems to repeat itself. Events are not concurrent, but consecutive in Revelation. One who doesn't understand the duplication scenario outlined in Revelation, will draw the conclusion, that it describes the same event, only in greater detail.

If you are saying the popular teachers are saying that Ezekial 38 is the final battle.....who are they?

.............................................benny cool.gif
Joshleet
Benny, I would rather not name Names. However, I will say that They have quite Large TV ministries. They don't have a clue that they are leading their flocks right into the arms of the False messiah. In the last Six months, I have found three that teach this. They just don't understand how crucial it is we understand the actual order of events in the end time. [indent][/indent]The majority of Prophetic teachings Have the 70th week, consisting of 3 1`/2 years of Peace, followed by 3 1/2 years of war. This is wrong, and the exact OPPOSITE of what the Word of God establishes. You see, the FIRST 3 12/ years of the TRUE 70th week will consist of very specific "birthpains" prophesied to Happen. This will be followed by the 42 month reign of the False messiah. What one doesn't realize, IS what will occur, if one accepts the 3 1/2 years of "birthpains" which occurs in the first half of the true 70th week, AS prophetic fulfillment, of the LAST HALF of a seven year period PERCIEVED TO BE THE FINAL SEVEN YEARS? It is the same time period, it is the same events. Will one recognise them as "birthpains" before the reign of Antichrist, or will one accept the events as Full prophetic fulfillement before the return of the real Messiah? If one does accept the Latter, you will be decieved into accepting the false messiah as the true! I Hope and Pray that isn't confusing!! "and if it were possable, even the elect will be decieved!!"
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