I am asking that anyone on the forum who reads this posted sermon and agrees with

it reply to it with an "I am all for it!" so that the whole forum community (and guests) can see how committed we are to the grace/love building up kind of language going forward.

Thank you in advance for participating (for all who will).



Make Your Mouth a Means of Grace

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By John Piper October 12, 1986


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Ephesians 4:29-30

Let no rotten word come out of your mouth, but if something is good for the upbuilding of a need, (let that come out of your mouth) in order that it might give grace to those who hear.
I remember one time as a child that my mother actually washed my mouth out with soap. She took me to the bathroom sink, rubbed the bar of soap around in my mouth, and then rinsed it out and made me go to my room. Do you know what I had said? I think I had said, "Shut up!" to my sister.

The Battle for Purity of Mouth Starts in the Heart
Now why should my mother wash my mouth out with soap for saying, "Shut up!" to my sister? She did it because she believed Jesus when he said, "It is not what goes into the mouth that defiles a man, but what comes out of the mouth, this defiles a man" (Matthew 15:11).

I had made myself dirty by saying, "Shut up," to my sister, and my mother had a white-hot zeal for my purity. So she used an unforgettable object lesson. I think she did right and I have risen up to call her blessed even this past week on her birthday.

"But really!" someone will say, "What's the big deal with saying, 'Shut up,' to your sister? It's not swearing. It's not taking the name of the Lord in vain. It's not a dirty word. Why get so worked up? What's really so bad about it?"

The answer is that when I said, "Shut up!" to my sister, it was mean. There was no affection and no good will and no kindness in it. It was ugly. There was no moral beauty, no holiness, no love. To use Paul's phrase in Ephesians 4:29, it was a "rotten word." It came from a garbage pile of pride and one-upmanship and anger and resentment—all very normal between siblings, and all very sinful. Beware lest you grow accustomed to sin because it is so normal!

But what I thank God for more than that my mother was intensely moral is that she was intensely Christian. She knew that soap in the mouth couldn't touch the dirt in my heart. If she had thought it could, she wouldn't have cried.

So she taught me the truth of Ephesians 4:22–24: "You must put off your old self-assertive, mean, uncaring self, son, because it is corrupt with deceitful desires. And put on the new meek and kind self created by God in his own likeness in righteousness and holiness. In other words, son, you need to be deeply renewed in the spirit of your mind."

In the end the battle for purity in the mouth is fought in the heart, because "out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks." If you don't like what comes out of your mouth, listen carefully this morning, because the apostle Paul is at pains in this text to clean up your mouth from the inside out.

Rotten, Evil, Unwholesome, Corrupt Words

Let's look at verse 29. I said a moment ago that Paul used the phrase "rotten word." The RSV translates it, "Let no evil talk come out of your mouths." The NIV and NASB use the word "unwholesome." And the KJV says, "Let no corrupt communication proceed out of your mouth." What is this idea behind the words, "evil," "unwholesome," and "corrupt"?

The Greek word (sapros) is used in only one other context in the New Testament, namely, the places in Matthew and Luke where Jesus says, "It is not the good tree that bears bad fruit "(Luke 6:43; Matthew 7:17f.; Matthew 12:33). The term for "bad" fruit here is the same word for evil or unwholesome or corrupt in Ephesians 4:29—"Let no evil talk come out of your mouth!" The image in Paul's mind is probably one of rottenness and decay, something that is spoiled.

This kind of rotten language must be taken off like the old garment. It is part of the old self of verse 22 that needs to be stripped away when a person becomes a Christian. The garment of a rotten mouth must be taken off and thrown into the fire, just like the Ephesians had burned their old books on magic in Acts 19:19.

Four Kinds of Language That May Be in Mind
Now what sort of talk does Paul have in mind when he says, "Let no rotten talk come out of your mouth"? Let me suggest at least four kinds of language that I think Paul would include as "rotten" or "decayed" or "spoiled."

1. Taking the Name of the Lord in Vain


First would be language that takes the name of the Lord in vain. It is a great contradiction of who we are as Christians if we say, "God!" or "My God!" or "God Almighty!" or "Christ!" or "Jesus!" just because we are mad or surprised or amazed. No one with a good marriage would stomp on his wedding ring to express anger. It stands for something precious and pure. And so does the name of God and Jesus Christ.

2. Trivializing Terrible Realities


The second kind of language that Paul would call rotten would be language that trivializes terrible realities—like hell and damnation and holiness. What's wrong with saying, "What the hell!" or "Hell, no!" or "Go to hell!" or "Damn it!" or "Damn right!" or "Holy cow!" or "Holy mackerel!"?

Among other things these expressions trivialize things of terrible seriousness. It's simply a contradiction to believe in the horrible reality of hell and use the word like a punctuation mark for emphasis when talking about sports or politics. The same is true of damnation. And if the divine command, "Be holy as I am holy," carries for you the same weight it carried for Moses and Jesus and the apostles, you will simply find that "Holy cow" or holy anything will stick in your throat because it treats something infinitely precious as a trifle.

3. Referencing Sex and the Body in Vulgar Ways


The third kind of language I think Paul would include in his command not to let any rotten talk come out of your mouth is vulgar references to sex and the human body. With this kind of language people take good things that God has made, and use them like mud to smear on whatever they get upset about. The whole assumption behind the use of vulgar four-letter words is that they communicate scorn or disdain or hate. How does this happen?

How, for example, does the act of sexual relations, created by God as good to be fulfilled in marriage—how does it get translated into a four letter word and carry the meaning of hate and scorn? The answer is easy: first you get God out of your mind. That's fundamental to all vulgarity. Then you get the sanctity of his creation out of your mind. And then, in your mind, you replace the tenderness of married love with the force of rape, and you've got yourself a four letter word which does verbally the same thing that rape does physically: it expresses selfish, uncaring abusiveness. (Which, incidentally, is why I would say to Christian women, don't spend two minutes with a man who uses this kind of language: rape and rotten language come from exactly the same root.)

4. Speaking in Mean-Spirited Ways


The final kind of language I think Paul would call rotten is mean-spirited language—like, "Shut up!" The words themselves are untarnished. But the usage is vicious and loveless.

Four Implications of Such Language
Those are the four kinds of language I think Paul would include in "rotten talk." Now let's step back and ask what Paul might mean by calling language evil or corrupt or unwholesome or rotten. If we think of spoiled or rotten fruit, like Jesus did, four implications come to mind.

1. It Does Not Nourish


First, rotten fruit does not nourish. Neither does rotten language. It does not strengthen or improve or help. It is not useful for food. It is good for nothing but to be thrown out and trampled under foot by men.

2. It Will Probably Make You Sick


Second, rotten fruit will probably make you sick if you do try to eat it. And rotten language can make people sick, too. In other words, it not only fails to give positive nourishment; it can cause negative harm. Words can wound a person very deeply. Words can be like the virus that transmits the disease of meanness or vulgarity from parent to child or roommate to roommate or colleague to colleague. Rotten language makes people sick if they are forced to eat it.

3. It Smells Bad and Makes the Atmosphere Unpleasant


Third, rotten fruit smells bad and makes the atmosphere unpleasant. I recall a couple of men in graduate school in Germany who seemed to carry the aroma of vulgarity about them. All they ever seemed to laugh at was sexual innuendo. The pitiful thing about it was that the nearer they got to the gutter, the more they laughed. With their mouths they created an atmosphere like a stinking locker room. It was unpleasant for everybody but themselves. And it made noble and high and worthy thoughts all but impossible. It's hard to savor beauty from a garbage dump. Can you stand in an "adult" bookstore and look through the window (if there were a window) and be moved by the beauty of a setting sun?

4. It Probably Comes from a Diseased Tree


The fourth implication that comes to mind when we think of rotten fruit and rotten language is that it probably comes from a diseased tree. If the fruit is rotten as soon as it appears on the branch (as soon as the words come out of the mouth), then the tree is bad.

Jesus said, "Out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaks. The good man out of his good treasure brings forth good, and the evil man out of his evil treasure brings forth evil. I tell you, on the day of judgment men will render account for every careless word they utter; for by your words you will be justified and by your words you will be condemned" (Matthew 12:34–37).

So if a person takes the name of God in vain, or trivializes the realities of hell and holiness, or turns sexuality into vulgarity, or makes words into weapons of one-upmanship and meanness, then we can say for sure, "There is a rottenness inside the tree as well as outside." If the fruit is bad, the root is bad.

A Whole New Way of Thinking About Language
If we see this, we won't be as surprised with what comes next in the text. It is not what you might expect. We might expect Paul to admonish us to clean up our language. We might expect him to talk about words that are not vulgar or rotten or corrupt, but are pure and wholesome and creative and clear. But Paul doesn't do what we expect.

Instead of proposing clean language, he proposes a whole new way of thinking about language. Instead of saying, "You don't need dirty language to communicate your intention," he says, "The root issue is whether your intention is love." In other words the issue for Paul is not really language at all; the issue is love. The issue is not whether our mouth can avoid gross language; the issue is whether our mouth is a means of grace. You see he shifts from the external fruit to the internal root. He shifts from what we say to why we say it. That's the issue.

Let's read verse 29.

Let no rotten talk come out of your mouth, but only what is good for edifying, as fits the occasion [literally: good for edifying of need—meeting a particular need is in view] that it may impart grace to those who hear.

Do you see the shift? He doesn't say, "Let no rotten talk come out of your mouth, but instead let fresh clean talk come out of your mouth." He says, "Let no rotten talk come out of your mouth, but ask this: Is my mouth a means of grace? Am I meeting a need with the words that are coming out of my mouth? Am I building up faith into the people who hear?"

The Far-Reaching, All-Encompassing Christian Faith

This is a revolutionary way to think about your mouth, just like verse 28 (last week) was a revolutionary way of thinking about your secular work. Do you see the parallel?

In verse 28 Paul said, "Let the thief no longer steal, but let him labor doing good with his hands," and then he shifts from the what to the why, "so that he may be able to give to those in need." In other words, it is not Christian just to stop stealing. It is not Christian just to work honestly in order to have things. It is Christian to work to have in order to give—to meet needs. All our work is to be a display of grace.

This is exactly what Paul does here in verse 29. He says, "Let no rotten talk come out of your mouth, but only what is good," and then he shifts from the what to the why, "for edification to meet a need that it may impart grace to those who hear." It is not Christian just to stop swearing. It is not Christian just to put good language in the mouth instead. It is Christian to ask the deeper, internal question: am I speaking now to edify? Is your mouth a means of grace?

All our secular work is to be a display of grace; and all our speech is to be a display of grace. Do you see how all-encompassing and how far reaching our Christian faith must be? These are amazing verses about the grace of God in our lives.

If my mother had only washed out my mouth with soap, and never prayed and labored to wash out my unloving heart with the gospel of the grace of God, I might today have an antiseptic mouth, but I probably wouldn't be a Christian.

A Christian is a person whose rotten root within has been made new by grace through faith in the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. The grace of God has taken the hate and anger and resentment that spill over in mean and vulgar and irreverent language, and has covered them with the blood of Christ and killed them along with the old unbelieving self.

Sealed for the Day of Redemption
And do you know what the grace of God has left behind in the place of the old hate and anger and resentment? It has left hope. This is the meaning of verse 30. It says, "And do not grieve the Holy Spirit of God, in whom you were sealed for the day of redemption."

What does this mean? It means that a Christian is a person in whom the Holy Spirit of God dwells, and that this Spirit of God seals the believer for the day of redemption. In other words, the Spirit God puts the stamp of his own image (4:24) on the life of the believer and guarantees that he will persevere to the day of redemption. The seal of the Spirit is the assurance of a secured hope.

The hope of all believers, guaranteed by the seal of the Spirit, is that at the end of history we will come to a day of redemption instead of a day of damnation. What, then, is this day of redemption?

It is the day when the long battle with sin will be over. It is the day when the deepest longings of our heart will be satisfied with the sight of the glory of the grace of God in the face of Jesus. No more groaning with imperfection; no more waiting; no more frustrated longings. Our redemption will be complete.

The Relationship of 4:30 to Our Language
So what is the point of Ephesians 4:30 in relation to rotten language and gracious language?

The point is this: Paul says that the Spirit has been given to seal us and secure us for an infinitely wonderful future. In other words, the Spirit's sealing work aims to give you hope! So how do you grieve this Spirit? By not hoping in the day of redemption! By not hoping in the power of the Spirit to secure you and help keep you. If the Holy Spirit has been sent to give you hope in God, and instead of hoping in God you fret over your problems and become angry and bitter and resentful, then you grieve the Holy Spirit of God. You strive against the very purpose for which he was sent.

And the language that comes out of a heart that doesn't hope in God will not impart grace to those who hear. How can you make your mouth a means of grace for others when you don't hope in the grace of God for yourself? It is out of hopeless hearts of discouragement and frustration and anger and bitterness and resentment that all rotten and hurtful language comes.

But if you as a believer stop and think for a moment that Christ has died for your sin, that God has promised to work all things together for your good, that he has given you his own Holy Spirit for the specific purpose of sealing you for the day of redemption, then surely a deep and confident hope will be the root of your life. And up through that root will flow the sap of grace, and out onto the branches of your life will come the fruit of a whole new way of talking.

The question for your mouth will not merely be the moral question: Am I avoiding dirty words? But the Christian question: Am I building the faith of others by what I say? Is my mouth a means of grace? Am I frightened and anxious and angry about my life, or am I filled and overflowing with hope that the Spirit of God will keep me safe for the day of redemption?


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I'll start the dance floor off - "Let's do it!"

Let the words of my mouth and the meditations of my heart be acceptable in thy sight, Oh Lord, my Rock and My Redeemer

Lord Jesus, help us!
You are coming back for your Word!
You are the Word!
Thy Word have I hid in my heart that I might not sin against Thee!
Help us to only speak your Word!
Thank you, Lord, that you give us a brand new start from this moment on!

A good man out of the good treasure of the heart bringeth forth good things; and an evil man out of the evil treasure bringeth forth evil things."
(Matthew 12:35)

"Death and life are in the power of the tongue; and they
that love it shall eat the fruit thereof."
(Proverbs 18:21)

Im all for it.

Lord help me to do it now.

Help me to be, think and speak righteously.

I got my mouth washed out with soap a couple of times too. I said the S__t word. I was riding my bike in the driveway while my dad and his business partner were working on one of their Kenworths and I heard all kinds of new words. It was a major double standard in those days.

CJ...are those desert fatigues you're wearing? Is that an M16 behind you? If you're there right now, don't tell us where you are, just say yes or no. My daughter was in Balad, Iraq, but it doesn't look like you are. Is this an old picture?

Thank you for your responses LoisFaith2000, Miche, CJ and GenesisGirl. Surely this cannot be all the forum posters that are up for trying it? The forum community (members, guests and anonymous) will look at the posts of the last few days and then this very small reply, comparatively speaking, and come to the conclusion that the majority of people here are more interested in continuing that than attempting this. I am saddened and disapointed...

From this day forward... I'm in... AMEN. CJ, Praying for you. My bro is in Iraq and every time I see or hear of someone putting their life on the line for us, I PRAY! Lord bless you!

Yes Lord, help me to control my sanguin ramblings, and fill my speech with grace!!!

Thank you very much Sharon and IrishRose (and all the others that are in on this topic) for your responses. I see a beautiful light dawning on this board. I am so happy that we are chosing the light to convince the unbelivers who come here that there is truly beauty in the kingdom of God (they, the unbelievers, will come to know, by experience, that the light cannot be found in the world, but only in the Kingdom).

The trouble is that the wound is still too fresh and I am being truthful when I say I have to pray on it. Sorry, but some folks tried to play the victim card by twisting words around and as the saying goes; I can forgive but it's more difficult to forget. But I will try from this day forward to: not say anything at all, if I have nothing nice to say.

Gods Blessings,

Al

PS- Sometimes peace can better be gotten by allowing all parties to air their differences instead of attempting to quiet the opposing party.

Al

Dear Adeline:

I do understand/appreciate what you are saying here! However, because time is so short and we need to be instantly ready to receive our loved ones from our very own families and also here on the board - God wants us (He is speaking loud and clear on this issue) to apply instant forgiveness.

Who is someone you know (family or friend) that is not saved and giving you a terrible time and is truly nasty????? Think it over! 5 minutes from now they can call you up with true repentance to God and to you! God instantly forgives them...................INSTANTLY! Now, we have to do the same. We are like our Daddy! We have to be the Lord's ready warriors to receive the loved ones for whom we have been praying.

Jesus also says in His Word, "forgive" that you might be healed! God is going to make every wrong that was done to us right. And, He can do a better job of it than we can. Vengeance is mine, saith the Lord.

You should really be thanking the Lord for such a quick and mighty turn-around that just happended here on the board. For, if, five of your unsaved friends were to come and fellowship here, they would see Jesus.
They would instantly be saved, touch Jesus, and bring their portion of Christ for all of us to enjoy!

Folks! Love colony! God's love colony, don't dwell in the past (even 5 minutes ago). We are new creatures in Christ each and every moment of each and every day. Breathe Him in. For our God is living and quick and powerful and sharper than any two-edged sword.

LoisFaith,

I have truly enjoyed your posts this past week, you soothed some hurts on my heart. Thank-you. I also love the pictures that you post. Anyway, this week I have gotten to know the people on this board a little better and I know that there are some real people with real gifts on this board. I think you and Pamela gave some really great advice mixed with some much needed wisdom. Maz and Iamlives (Kim) wrote some really wonderful posts that made me sit up, take notice, and pay attention to. And Irish Rose? I found a rose I could smell in the garden in Gods world, amidst some really painful thorns.

I understand how God can forgive us in an instant, for that is our God. Our Lord who has the capacity for unconditional love. Praise God. But a few on this board (Christians) have made snide remarks and twisted my words around and for what? I can't forget that overnight, perhaps next week but not overnight.

BTW- I think Justice is back in the form of our newest member on the board. Any sort of nastiness from her and her posts shall be immediately reported.

Lois, I am also human and I don't need trolls to fling my name in the mud.

Soon very soon her colors will come out, again. They always do...just a matter of time.

In Christian Love,

Al

HGIAR,

I'm sorry to have posted something inappropriate on your thread when you have given us food for thought here. Please forgive me. It was rude and uncalled for.

Love, Rose

surely all of this contention cannot be healthy...isn't there just an ignore button somewhere here...oyyyy...from the pariah to the priestly...doesn't God have other plans for us?


Praying this all goes away

God bless

Hi IrishRose and Adeline,

I can understand where you are coming from, but this is what I have discovered. The Lord wants us to die to ourselves and have Him live through us - carrying your cross is another term for it. But, I have noticed that He gets very large returns from His investments of resources for His Kingdom. If you look at how He lived His life He called people to follow Him, taught, etc... However, when He detected that the people's hearts were not receptive, He attempted to correct them but then left to make the offer/teach others, if they would not hear him and straighten up. He never stayed and catered to the person and He never argued and pleaded with people for long periods of time. He never wasted His energy. He also told the disciples the same when He sent them out. He told them to leave and kick the dust off their feet if they were not accepted and if the people would not listen to their words. He didn't tell them to stay and argue it out. Basically, don't waste your time with them if they are not receptive.

Our minstering to people is a gift to them. We are called to love others. If they don't want our love, they are free to reject it. Maybe He'll send them someone else, but if they don't want His gift to them through you, let them go.

From looking at these scriptures, I determined that I am to love fully, help those who are open to be helped, fellowship with those who are refreshing to me, and let go of those who just want to waste the precious time that the Lord has to work through me via love. So I continue love/help those I can (and are given to me by the Lord to help) until and unless I determine, via the help of the Holy Spirit, by means of renewal of the mind, that His efforts through me are a waste of time. At that point, when I realize my efforts are being wasted and it is no longer love to the other person (they are just using me for their bickering entertainment), I devote my efforts elsewhere. This means not allowing them to use my Lord's resource (my time and energy), which can manfest as ignoring their tactics.

Love is a very strange concept. In Godly terms, it should be agape love, which means doing what is in the best interest of another person. This may be what they want, or not what they want (ie...corrective advice). The Spirit can swing very quickly from loving support (when it is agape love (in the best interst) of another person) to non-support (when the other person is not benefitted by support - ie...when they begin to use the situation). The Holy Spirit is the sword that can divide between the marrow and the bones, He knows exactly when to swing from the Lamb to the Lion. I find, our Lord is both a lamb, to those coming to/growing in Him and a Lion to those that are trying to take advantage of His children (Him).

Anyhow, I may have gone way off topic here. The point is that I think the absence of your love is a worse situation for those who are trying to waste your time than continuing to argue with them is. They like to argue with you, thereby wasting your time and making you unproductive for the Kingdom of God.

If the Devil cannot convince you to lose your faith, He'll at least try to make you unproductive. Also, I don't think that too many of the Christians on this board are duped by rotten apples. No defense does not necessarily mean everyone believes what they are sayinganyway, it usually just means that it is not worthy of a loving response (determined to be so obviously wasteful of time that a response would be nonproductive). If all the Christians on this board adopted this approach, consistently, the ignored person would leave the board from complete boredom eventually.

13 When the devil had finished all this tempting, he left him until an opportune time.

Let's not give the Devil any opportunity!

His Glory,

I understand what you are saying and I think that Christianity is a process we must all go through...I am not where I should be but thank God I'm not where I used to be. So please don't expect that I should be on the same spiritual growth scale as you are. You have no idea the added strain that Justice puts on a whole forum family. If you would like to minister to this newest poster, than please do, but not all of us are meant to effectively minister to her. As I have said, I will be reporting any argumentive post that strikes me as being from Justice. God tells me to love Justice but God doesn't tell me to ignore her bad behavior. Her bad behavior shall not be ignored for any length of time and shall be reported.

Gods Blessings,

Al

Hi Al,

I can always take the approach of "agree to disagree" and carry on as friendly as usual. I just thought I would share what I've learned over time, as I thought it may help. I'll follow my approach of ignore and you and IrishRose can follow yours of report. There shall be no contention between us, I respect and appreciate you both.

God Bless You Both,
HGIARainbow

Thank-you so much and I do respect you and your posts. And yes, sometimes its really okay if we just agree to disagree. Thank-you for your understanding.

In Christian Love,

Al

Praise the Lord! All!

I guess that wherever Christians meet there will always be hundreds of opinions! eVEN, JUST, 2 Christians meeting together, there are opinions. Isn't it great that only thing we need to agree on is Jesus! In the spirit, everyone here is right! In the spirit, there is no right or wrong. For all who worship Him, must worship Him in spirit and in truth and love! We just need to agree on Jesus who is love and truth and peace! Sometimes, I just have to go with this statement! Do whatever will keep the PEACE! Jesus is our prince of PEACE!

Thanks Loey and AMEN! Dancin with ya!